††1†† THE INTERNATIONAL CRIMINAL TRIBUNAL††††† CASE NO. IT-95-14-PT
† 2†† FOR THE FORMER YUGOSLAVIA
† 3†† IN THE TRIAL CHAMBER
† 6††† Date: Friday, 14 February 1997
†13†† JUDGE McDONALD
†14††† (The Confirming Judge)
†20†† THE PROSECUTOR OF THE TRIBUNAL
†24†† TIHOMIR BLASKIC
† 8†† MR. MARK HARMON, MR. GREGORY KEHOE and MR. ANDREW CAYLEY appeared on
† 9†† behalf of the Prosecution
†11†† MME. VASVIJA VIDOVIC appeared as representative of Bosnia-Herzegovina
†16†† (Open session )
†18†† (10.00 a.m.)
†19†† USHER:††††† All rise.Veuillez vous lever.
†20†† ††††††††††† The International Criminal Tribunal for the Former Yugoslavia
†21†† is now †††††††††† in session.
†22††† †††††††††† Líaudience du Tribunal Penal pour líex-Yougoslavie est
†25†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: This is a hearing on the Order to show cause with
† 1†† respect to the issuance of Subpoenas Duces Tecum to Bosnia and
† 2†† Herzegovina and the Republic of Croatia.† Who is appearing for the
† 3†† Prosecution ?
† 4†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON:† Good morning, Your Honour.† My name is
† 5†† Mark Harmon.† I represent the Office of the Prosecutor in this
† 6†† Hearing and present with me are my colleagues Mr. Gregory Kehoe and
† 7†† Mr. Andrew Cayley.
† 8†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Thank you, Mr. Harmon.† And, for Bosnia-Herzegovina ?
† 9†† VASVIJA VIDOVIC: My name is Vasvija Vidovic.† I am an authorised
†10†† representative of Bosnia-Herzegovina for contacts with the
†11†† International Tribunal for War Crimes.
†12†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Do we have a representative from the Republic of
†13†† Croatia present today ?† No, there is no representative from the
†14†† Republic of Croatia ?† Iíll ask the Registry, what information do
†15†† you have with respect to the issuance of the Subpoena Duces Tecum
†16†† addressed to the Republic of Croatia ?
†17†† THE REGISTRY: Your Honour, we received a letter yesterday from the
†18†† Republic of Croatia, which you have a copy of, and I think the
†19†† Prosecutor also has a copy of, in which they make a reply and it is
†20†† unclear whether they said they would appear today but given the
†21†† reply I donít think that they will appear today.
†22†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: We will make that letter, thatís the letter dated 13
†23†† June 1996, as well as the reply a part of the record for todayís
†24†† proceeding.† Mr. Harmon, you may proceed.
†25†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: Your Honour, I would also ask that, as part
† 1†† of the record, there be introduced the proof of service on the
† 2†† Republic of Croatia I have been provided by the Registrarís office a
† 3†† certification of delivery of the Subpoena Duces Tecum indicating
† 4†† that on 17 January 1997 copies of two certified copies of Subpoenas
† 5†† Duces Tecum signed by Your Honour were delivered to Mr. Orsat
† 6†† Miljenic of the Embassy of the Republic of Croatia on 17 January
† 7†† 1997.†
† 8†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Do you have that, Mr. Bos ?
† 9†† THE REGISTRY: Yes, we do.
†10†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: OK, that will also then be made a part of the record
†11†† for todayís proceedings.
†12†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: Thank you, Your Honour.† Your Honour, the
†13†† Subpoena Duces Tecums that were served on the Republic of Croatia
†14†† being directed to Mr. Susak articulate with specificity certain
†15†† documents that are necessary for the preparation of the conduct of
†16†† the trial of General Blaskic.† The Subpoenas themselves directed a
†17†† representative of the Republic of Croatia to appear before Your
†18†† Honour today and directed Mr. Susak or one of his representatives as
†19†† well to appear in the event of non-compliance.† I wish to inform
†20†† Your Honour that there have been no compliance whatsoever with the
†21†† Subpoenas.† We have never received a single document in response of
†22†† these two Subpoenas from the..... Republic of Croatia.† What we did
†23†† receive was what Mr. Bos said was a or was entitled a reply to the
†24†† Subpoena Duces Tecum offered by Doctor Srecko Jelinic and in my view
†25†† that does not constitute compliance with the Subpoena Duces Tecum,
† 1†† either the production of documents, nor is it comply with the
† 2†† requirement that representatives be ..... present from Mr. Susakís
† 3†† office and from the Republic of Croatia.† It is our position, Your
† 4 ††Honour, that the Subpoena Duces Tecums that have been issued by this
† 5†† Court are directed appropriately, by lawful orders of this Court,
† 6†† and cannot be and should not be ignored.† We have a request of this
† 7†† Court that by Wednesday 19 February 1997, at 2:00 oíclock, Mr. Susak
† 8†† again be directed to produce the documents that are described in the
† 9†† Subpoena Duces Tecum.† Our second request is that the Republic of
†10†† Croatia again be directed to ensure compliance with the Subpoena
†11†† Duces Tecum and, in the event that there is non-compliance with the
†12†† Subpoenas Duces Tecum on or by 19 February 1997 we would request
†13†† that Mr. Susak or another representative of the Ministry of Defence
†14†† and a representative of the Republic of Croatia personally appear
†15†† before Your Honour and inform this Court of how and when it intends
†16†† to comply with the Subpoena Duces Tecum or state on the record
†17†† whether it refuses to comply with the lawful order of this Court.†
†18†† That is my submission, Your Honour, in respect of the Subpoena Duces
†19†† Tecum for Croatia.† I am prepared to also address the second
†20†† Subpoena Duces Tecum that was issued.
†21†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Ms. Vidovic, do you have anything to say with respect
†22†† to this request ?† You are here, as I understand it, on behalf of
†23†† Bosnia-Herzegovina.† We will address that Subpoena Duces Tecum when
†24†† we have completed the request with respect to the Subpoena directed
†25†† to the Republic of Croatia, but do you have anything to say
† 1†† regarding this matter ?
† 2††† VASVIJA VIDOVIC: No, I donít have anything to say in relation to the
† 3†† Subpoena directed to the Republic of Croatia but only in relation to
† 4†† the Subpoena directed to Bosnia-Herzegovina.
† 5†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Your request, Mr. Harmon, will be granted, and order
† 6†† will be entered today granting that request.
† 7†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: Thank you, Your Honour.
† 8†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Is there anything else with respect to the Subpoena
† 9†† directed to the Republic of Croatia ?
†10†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: Not at this time, Your Honour.
†11†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Very good.† Now you may proceed then to address the
†12†† Subpoena Duces Tecum addressed to Bosnia-Herzegovina.
†13†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: Thank you, Your Honour.† The Subpoena that
†14†† was directed to Bosnia and Herzegovina was directed first of all to
†15†† the custodian of the records of the central archives of what was
†16†† formerly the Ministry of Defence of the Croatian Community of Herceg
†17†† Bosna and it was directed to Bosnia and Herzegovina to ensure
†18†† compliance with the Subpoena Duces Tecum.† As part of the record,
†19†† Your Honour, I would also ask that the proof of service of those two
†20†† Subpoenas be entered into the record.† Service was made on the
†21†† Bosnian Embassy on 22 January 1997.†
†22†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: That request will be granted and a proof of service
†23† †will be made a part of the record.
†24†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: Thank you, Your Honour.† In respect of non-
†25†† compliance, the Subpoena Duces Tecum that was signed by Your Honour
† 1†† requested that a representative of Bosnia and Herzegovina appeared
† 2†† and Madame Vidovic is here in response to that request. The Order
† 3†† also required that the custodian of the records of what was formerly
† 4†† the central archives of the Ministry of Defence appear before Your
† 5†† Honour to show cause as to why there has been non-compliance.† I can
† 6†† report to Your Honour that there has been either substantial non-
† 7†† compliance with this Order or there has been partial or very partial
† 8†† compliance and the reason I hesitate in explaining, the reason I
† 9†† equivocate a bit is, yes, two days ago, our representative, Mr.
†10†† Jean-Pierre Capelle, was summoned by Mr. Primorac.† Mr. Primorac is
†11†† the assistant of the Ministry of Defence of the Bosnian Federation
†12†† and Mr. Primorac and Mr. Jean-Pierre Capelle, our representative,
†13†† met him citlock in Bosnia and during the course of that meeting
†14†† eleven documents were provided to Mr. Jean-Pierre Capelle.† I do not
†15†† know whether those eleven documents, which have yet to be
†16†† translated, were made in response to the Subpoena Duces Tecum or
†17†† were made in response to previous requests for assistance that we
†18†† have made of Mr. Primorac in the past.† In any event, however, the
†19†† eleven documents do not represent anywhere near complete compliance
†20†† with this Subpoena.† Eleven documents given I think in that
†21†† particular Subpoena, let me see exactly, they requested, Your
†22†† Honour, 19 items.† The eleven documents represent substantial non-
†23†† compliance if those documents were intended to be in compliance with
†24†† this Subpoena at all.† Now, I have received from Mr. Jean-Pierre
†25†† Capelle a copy of a letter that he asked that, that you received
† 1†† from Mr. Primorac.† Mr. Primorac asked that I deliver a copy of this
† 2†† letter to Your Honour, which I am prepared to do.† Maybe I should
† 3†† provide this letter to you, Your Honour.† It is a copy of a letter
† 4†† directed to Madam Vidovic but it also has, I have been directed by
† 5†† Mr. Capelle and Mr. Primorac to provide you with a copy of it and
† 6†† attached to that, Your Honour, is a translation.
† 7†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Mr. Harmon, you may proceed.† This letter then is
† 8†† from Mrs. Vidovic, is that correct ?
† 9†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON:† Your Honour, this letter is from Mr. Ante
†10†† Jelavic, who is the
†11†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Oh no I see it is addressed to Mr. Vidovic and signed
†12†† by Mr. Jelavic.
†13†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: That is correct, your Honour.† And I was
†14†† asked to provide that copy of the letter to you through Mr. Jean-
†15†† Pierre Capelle, who received those instructions from Mr. Primorac,
†16†† who is the representative of our liaison, he is the representative
†17†† of the Defence Ministry.
†18†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Do you want this letter to be made a part of the
†19†† record ?
†20†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON:† I think it should be, Your Honour, yes.
†21†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: OK, this one then will be made a part of the record.†
†22†† Now, then letís address this letter in terms of its meaning.† Mr.
†23†† Jelavic says that the Ministry of Defence of Herceg Bosna has ceased
†24†† to exist.† He then goes on to say however in order to demonstrate
†25†† cooperation with the International Criminal Tribunal, he has asked
† 1†† the HVO to facilitate contact between the Director of the War
† 2†† archives of the former Ministry of Defence of the Croatian Republic
† 3†† of Herceg Bosna and the International Criminal Tribunal and he has
† 4†† been informed by the HVO that the acting director of HVO, HZHB War
† 5†† Archives, Mr. Bercic died of natural causes on 25 November 1996 and
† 6†† a new director has been appointed.† Then he says what, in the future
††7†† that the Ministry of Defence shall be available.† What does all this
† 8†† mean ?† So the proper custodian I gather has died, well, the letter
† 9†† speaks for itself, you tell me how you interpret it, perhaps we will
†10†† hear from Mrs. Vidovic regarding the letter and how it affects
†11†† compliance with the Subpoena.
†12†† THE PROSECUTOR - MARK HARMON: Yes, Your Honour.† Very frankly, the letter
†13†† is a mystery to me.† The untimely death of Mr. Bercic didnít prevent
†14†† the Ministry of Defence from providing us with eleven documents that
†15†† presumably are responsive to one of our requests for assistance or
†16†† responsive to the Subpoena.† Those archives continue to exist.† The
†17†† death of Mr. Bercic is unfortunate but those archives have not
†18†† disappeared and they are still under the custody and control of the
†19†† Ministry of Defence and Mr. Ante Jelavic is aware of where those
†20†† archives are.† The fact that they have not named a new archivist
†21†† does not preclude them from complying with this Subpoena and very
†22†† frankly, Your Honour, I think that the Subpoena that we have served
†23†† should be, I would request an additional order in respect of that
†24†† Subpoena directed to the custodian of the records and what I would
†25†† presently request, because I think Ante Jelavic knows where those
† 1†† documents are, who has control of those documents.† I would ask,
† 2†† Your Honour, that Mr. Ante Jelavic be directed to produce by 19
† 3†† February 1997 the documents that are described in the Subpoena Duces
† 4†† Tecum.† I would additionally request, Your Honour, that Bosnia and
† 5†† Herzegovina again be directed to ensure compliance with this
† 6†† Subpoena Duces Tecum and my third request is, in the event of non-
† 7†† compliance with this Subpoena Duces Tecum by Wednesday 19 February
† 8†† 1997, that Mr. Jelavic personally or a representative from the
† 9†† Ministry of Defence who is familiar with location and the contents
†10†† of what was formerly the Central Archives of the Ministry of Defence
†11†† of the Croatian community of Herceg Bosna appear before Your Honour
†12†† to answer questions relevant to the production of the requested
†14†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Is there anything else with respect to the Subpoena
†15†† Duces Tecum issued to Bosnia and Herzegovina ?
†16†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: No, Your Honour.
†17†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: OK, fine.† Thank you. Ms. Vidovic.
†18†† VASVIJA VIDOVIC: Your Honour, the Subpoena Duces Tecum, in order to ensure
†19†† its compliance I forwarded this Subpoena to all competent
†20†† authorities of Bosnia and Herzegovina and the Federation of Bosnia
†21†† and Herzegovina.† The Subpoena was received by the Embassy on 22
†22†† January 1997 and it was then sent personally to the co-chairman of
†23†† the Ministerial Council of Bosnia and Herzegovina.† Because all
†24†† other ministeries of Bosnia and Herzegovina, ministeries that
†25†† according to our regulations would be authorised to ensure
† 1†† compliance with the Subpoena are actually within his authority.† It
† 2†† was also sent to the Prime Minister of the Federation of Bosnia and
† 3†† Herzegovina because he is in charge of the Ministry of Justice of
† 4†† Bosnia and Herzegovina, which would be the body competent to ensure
† 5†† compliance with court orders including those issued by the
† 6†† International Tribunal in The Hague and also to the Ministry of
† 7†† Defence of the Federation of Bosnia and Herzegovina because it was
† 8†† known that the Ministry of Defence of the Federation of Bosnia and
† 9†† Herzegovina is a legal successor of the War Archives of Herceg Bosna
†10†† as well as the War Archives of the army of Bosnia and Herzegovina,
†11†† and the Croatian Defence Council is part of that organisation.† The
†12†† service was carried through the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of
†13†† Bosnia and Herzegovina and the Croatian Defence Council is part of
†14†† that organisation.† The service was carried out through the Ministry
†15†† of Foreign Affairs of Bosnia and Herzegovina and they informed me
†16†† with the letter of 27 January 1997 which I will deliver to you and I
†17†† will ask that it be made part of the record, whereby they informed
†18†† me that they sent Subpoena and also they sent proof on delivery.†
†19†† Proofs of delivery was also given that it was handed over to the
†20†† Ministry of Justice of the Federation of Bosnia and Herzegovina, Mr.
†21†† Mato Tadic.† I do not oppose, on the contrary, I think it would be
†22†† very useful that the representative of the legal successor of the
†23†† War Archives of the Croatian Defence Council appear before the Trial
†24†† Chamber and explain why the Subpoena has not been complied with.† I
†25†† therefore, as an authorised representative of Bosnia and
† 1†† Herzegovina, have done everything that was in my power to ensure
† 2†† service of Subpoena and it was sent to all authorised bodies and
† 3†† ministeries of Bosnia and Herzegovina and those of the Federation of
† 4†† Bosnia and Herzegovina.† Thank you.
† 5†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Thank you, Ms. Vidovic.† The first consideration that
† 6†† we have is to determine I suppose to what extent the Subpoena has
† 7†† been complied with, and you have indicated, Mr. Harmon, that eleven
† 8†† documents were delivered by Mr. Primorac to Jean-Pierre Capelle.† Of
† 9†† course those have not been translated, and you are correct, you have
†10†† requested nineteen different documents but if we were optimistic,
†11†† then you would have eleven out of the nineteen and then we would
†12†† only need to focus on eight.† But we donít know that yet.† How long
†13†† do you anticipate that it would take to have the documents that you
†14†† have received translated ?
†15†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: I could have them probably sight-translated
†16†† within the next hour and then I can report to Your Honour whether
†17†† those comply with any portions of the Subpoena.
†18†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: OK.† And then at that point at least we would know
†19†† what it is that you have requested that has not been provided to
†21†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: Correct, Your Honour.
†22†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: And then we could perhaps focus a little more
†23†† specifically on what it is that we need Mr. Jelavic to produce.†
†24†† Thatís probably the best way to proceed.† From listening to Ms.
†25†† Vidovic, it appears that Mr. Jelavic is the proper person to produce
† 1†† the documents that the Ministry of Defence is the legal successor to
† 2†† the War Archives and even if the Director of the War Archives is
† 3†† deceased and a successor has not been appointed, his superior is Mr.
† 4†† Jelavic.† So thatís not a problem.† So it seems to me that we should
† 5†† then, if there is non-compliance, direct an order to Mr. Jelavic.†
† 6†† Is that how you would suggest that we proceed ?† Ms. Vidovic has
† 7†† indicated that she also sent a copy of the, I gather you sent a copy
† 8†† of the Subpoena Duces Tecum as well as a letter to the Prime
† 9†† Minister of Bosnia-Herzegovina.† Is that correct ?
†10†† VASVIJA VIDOVIC: Yes, it is correct.
†11†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: And to the Bosna-Herceg Federation and to the
†12†† Minister of Justice.† But, if I understand, Ms. Vidovic, the person
†13†† who would have custody or at least control over the person who has
†14†† custody of these documents, would be Mr. Jelavic.† Why donít we then
†15†† recess these proceedings for the necessary period of time for you to
†16†† examine the documents that you have received, then report back Mr.
†17†† Harmon, then tell me what it is that you wish to be ordered by me.
†18†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: Fine, Your Honour.† I can complete that
†19†† probably within the hour.
†20†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: OK.† Ms. Vidovic, how does that procedure comport
†21†† with your schedule ?
†22†† VASVIJA VIDOVIC: I have no problem with that.† Thatís fine, thank you.
†23†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE:† Excuse me for a minute.† We were to recess this
†24†† proceeding until 1:00 oíclock.† Would that meet the schedules of Mr.
†25†† Harmon and Ms. Vidovic ?
† 1†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: Yes, Your Honour.
† 2†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Very good.† And perhaps the two of you can confer.†
† 3†† Ms. Vidovic has always been cooperative in the past.† Perhaps the
† 4†† two of you can confer, take a look at the documents and perhaps
† 5†† reach an agreement and the most, to the extent that you can narrow
† 6†† the request to me, I would appreciate it.
† 7†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: Fine, Your Honour, thank you very much.
† 8†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Then we will stand in recess until 1:00 p.m. today.
†10†† All Rise - Veuillez vous lever.
†12†† All Rise - Veuillez vous lever.
†13†† Please be seated.
†14†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE:† We recessed this morning and we have now reconvened
†15†† for the purpose of the Prosecution giving me the benefit of your
†16†† examination of the materials that were submitted by Bosnia and
†17†† Herzegovina or which were perhaps submitted by Bosnia and
†18†† Herzegovina in response to the Subpoena Duces Tecum.† But certainly
†19†† those with eleven items that you received.† You may proceed, Mr.
†21†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: Thank you very much, Your Honour.† Yes I
†22†† have had, in recess, I have had time to review each of those
†23†† documents.† Eleven short orders prepared by General Blaskic at
†24†† various dates and times that are relevant to this proceeding.† Those
†25†† documents appear to be responsive, Your Honour, in part, to item
† 1†† Nr.5 on the Subpoena Duces Tecum.† However, I would like to point
† 2†† out to the Court that we have also made requests for assistance from
† 3†† Mr. Primorac.† The first request for assistance was made on 2 May
† 4†† 1996 and the eleven documents that we received are responsive as
† 5†† well to our request for assistance that we made on 2 May 1996.† Now,
† 6†† when these documents were turned over to Mr. Jean-Pierre Capelle by
† 7†† Mr. Primorac, according to the report that I have received from Mr.
† 8†† Capelle, Mr. Primorac did not specify to which of our requests,
† 9†† whether they were the request or whether they were the Subpoena,
†10†† that these eleven documents responded to.† However and he also said
†11†† that he did not receive information from whom he had received these
†12†† documents, neither did Mr. Primorac say I received these from the
†13†† Central Archives from which there is no information available.
†14† †THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Did you have at that time the list of the requests as
†15†† you have presently drafted them, the nineteen ?
†16†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: Yes, Your Honour.† I believe that Mr.
†17†† Capelle had a copy of the Subpoena with him...
†18†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: OK.
†19†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: ...at the time he met with Mr. Primorac.
†20†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: So he basically gave you these eleven short orders
†21†† without telling you how they responded or to which request they
†23†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: Thatís correct.† And itís my conclusion,
†24†† Your Honour, that there is overlap between the request for
†25†† assistance that we made on 2 May as well as item Nr. 5 of the
† 1†† Subpoena Duces Tecum, but I would submit, Your Honour, that
† 2†† considering the request in item Nr. 5 requesting all military
† 3†† orders, instructions, reports and regulations signed and unsigned
† 4†† issued by or on behalf of† Tihomir Blaskic while he was the
† 5†† commander of the Central Bosnia operation zone or originally from
† 6†† the Central Bosnia operation zone command, that eleven orders do not
† 7†† come anywhere near full compliance with item nr.5.† Those eleven
† 8†† items that we have received obviously do not comply with any of the
† 9†† other matters that we have requested compliance with.† So thatís my
†10†† report, Your Honour, in terms of what those documents are and Iím
†11†† prepared to make an additional request of this Court in light of
†12†† what I believe would be substantial non-compliance.
†13†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Thank you very much.† Ms. Vidovic, do you wish to
†14†† respond ?
†15†† VASVIJA VIDOVIC: No, Your Honour.† I endorse the proposal of the
†18†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Iím sorry.† Would you repeat that for me ?
†19†† VASVIJA VIDOVIC: No, Your Honour.† I second the proposal by the
†21†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Did you have an opportunity to confer with the
†22†† Prosecutor to review the eleven documents that had been provided to the
†23†† Prosecutor ?
†24†† VASVIJA VIDOVIC: Yes, I had an opportunity, a brief opportunity to look at
†25†† those documents and I agree with Mr. Harmonís opinion that these are
† 1†† the documents that only in part of one item do comply with the
† 2†† Subpoena of the Tribunal about the release of the documents.
† 3†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Thank you.† Mr. Harmon, how do you wish us to
† 4†† proceed?† Do you wish us to then enter an order similar to the one
† 5†† that I intend on entering with respect to the Republic of Croatia ?†
† 6†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: Yes, Your Honour, I would propose that the
† 7†† order take, address the following items.† The first request I have,
† 8†† Your Honour, is that Mr. Ante Jelavic be directed to produce the
† 9†† documents described in the Subpoena Duces Tecum by Wednesday 19
†10†† February 1997 at 2:00 p.m.†† I would additionally request that the
†11†† Republic of Bosnia and Herzegovina again be directed to ensure
†12†† compliance with the Subpoena Duces Tecum and in the event of non-
†13†† compliance with the Subpoena Duces Tecum by Wednesday 19 February
†14†† that Mr. Jelavic personally appear before you to answer questions
†15†† relevant to the production of the Subpoena documents.†† Now if Mr.
†16†† Jelavic cannot personally appear on 19 February, I would request
†17†† that a representative from the Ministry of Defence personally appear
†18†† in his stead but I would request that the Court further order that
†19†† that representative, who appear instead of Mr. Jelavic, must be
†20†† someone who is familiar with the location and the contents of what
†21†† was formerly the Central Archives of the Ministry of Defence of the
†22†† Croatian community of Herceg Bosna and must be able to describe in
†23†† detail what steps have been taken to comply with the Subpoena Duces
†24†† Tecum since it was received by the Ministry of Defence on 23 January
† 1†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Today is the 14th.† If the order was entered today it
† 2†† would then be transferred and how long do you think it would take
† 3†† before he received it.
† 4†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: I would defer, Your Honour, to ....
† 5†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Ms. Vidovic.† Iím really just concerned about the
† 6†† time and we talked this morning about setting a date of 19 February
† 7†† also for the Croatian or for the Subpoena Duces Tecum addressed to
† 8†† the Republic of Croatia.† Thatís a different situation though,
† 9†† because there they have not complied at all, they have not appeared,
†10†† they have not submitted anything.† Here, however, it appears to me
†11†† that something has been submitted but I hear what you say and that
†12†† you say that it certainly not full compliance with request Nr. 5.†
†13†† What do you mean with respect to your second request that Bosnia and
†14†† Herzegovina assure compliance ?† Who specifically should we look to
†15†† assure this compliance other than the Minister of Defence ?
†16†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON:† Well I think the highest levels of the
†17†† government have to ensure compliance with the Court order, who
†18†† personally I canít say, Your Honour, I think if this Subpoena is
†19†† delivered to the official government representative of Bosnia and
†20†† Herzegovina, they can obviously designate who they believe should
†21†† ensure that compliance.† As we have done in the previous Subpoena,
†22†† the previous Subpoena was served on Madam Vidovic, she accepted
†23†† service of that Subpoena and then disseminated that Subpoena to the
†24†† appropriate government persons and she has come back before this
†25†† Court to report, you know what steps sheís taken to ensure the
† 1†† compliance.† I think the same procedures should be followed, that is
† 2†† that a new Court order be served on Madam Vidovic and that Madam
† 3†† Vidovic can then disseminate that order as she deems appropriate and
† 4†† can report back to this Court with Mr. Jelavic as well because I
† 5†† have every confidence that an order served by this Court, and Madam
† 6†† Vidovic will get to Mr. Jelavic in the appropriate time and I would
† 7†† also underscore that presumably Mr. Jelavic has been working
† 8†† dutifully to comply with the remaining parts of this Subpoena so
† 9†† itís going to, itís going to come as no surprise I suspect that we
†10†† expect a complete production.
†11†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Well, and you have also requested that he either have
†12†† those records produced by 19 February or appear in person to explain
†13†† why so that if he is for example unable to produce all of the
†14†† documents he is welcome to appear on the 19th to explain perhaps
†15†† heís produced four or five, or six or seven, or eleven...
†16†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: or eleven, or perhaps even more.
†17†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: And then explain why he has not been able to produce
†18†† the others and how much time even is needed to produce the others if
†19†† heís willing to go forward.
†20†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: Thatís correct.† What I think is absolutely
†21†† important in this proceeding, Your Honour, so we donít go to another
†22†† Court hearing and we have a representative of Mr. Jelavic show up
†23†† who knows nothing about the location and the contents of the
†24†† Archives and is unable to answer relevant questions about what
†25†† efforts have been taken to comply with the Court order.† Thatís why
† 1†† I stress the importance in any order that the person who is the
† 2†† designee of Mr. Jelavic be someone who can answer relevant
† 3†† questions.† Now, Your Honour, if the court ...
† 4†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: I think the 19th is OK.† I was really just thinking
† 5†† out loud but if itís drafted in a way that would permit Mr. Jelavic
† 6†† to appear and explain his progress and any problems that heís having
† 7†† perhaps itís important to have it that way, we need to move it
† 8†† along.† You have a trial setting, donít you, in this matter ?
† 9†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: We have, the trial date itself has not been
†10†† settled, we have a motions hearing on 12 March to the 14th and a
†11†† trial date will be set shortly thereafter.† I anticipate the trial
†12†† will follow shortly after the hearing and the motions.
†13†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: And so itís important I gather for you to have these
†14†† documents to prepare for your motion hearing, or is it ....
†15†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: Itís important for us to prepare for the
†16†† trial, clearly.
†17†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: OK.† Is there anything else ?
†18†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: No, Your Honour, thank you.
†19†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Anything else, Ms. Vidovic ?
†20†† VASVIJA VIDOVIC: I doubt.
†21†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Then the request of the Prosecution will be granted
†22†† and order will be entered as requested directed to Bosnia and
†23†† Herzegovina and specifically, in addition to that, directed to Mr.
†24†† Jelavic, directing that he appear, that he produce the records
†25†† requested in the Subpoena Duces Tecum by 19 February 1997 at 2:00
† 1†† a.m. or that he appear in person to explain why he is not able to
† 2†† produce those records.† Does that meet your request, Mr. Harmon?†
† 3†† And that, of course, the Subpoena Duces Tecum will as well provided
† 4†† to Ms. Vidovic as the coordinator, the liaison with the
† 5†† International Tribunal so that she can assure that the appropriate
† 6†† representative of Bosnia and Herzegovina has the Subpoena and we
† 7†† would expect that under the agreement that we have, that that
† 8†† appropriate representative cooperate in the compliance.
† 9†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: The only other aspect of the order, Your
†10†† Honour, is that if Mr. Jelavic cannot personally appear, that he
†11†† send a representative who is knowledgeable completely about the
†12†† location and the whereabouts of these archives and what steps have
†13†† been made to comply with this Subpoena.† And, Your Honour,
†14†† obviously, the appearance day will be 19 February at 2:00 p.m.†
†15†† Thank you.
†16†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Fine.† The request then of the Prosecution is granted
†17†† and order will be entered to that effect today.† Are there
†18†† additional matters that need to be considered ?
†19†† THE PROSECUTION - MARK HARMON: No further matters on behalf of the
†21†† VASVIJA VIDOVIC: Nothing further.
†22†† THE PRESIDING JUDGE: Then we will adjourn.† Thank you.