Case No IT-95-14
1 Friday, 27th June 1997
2 (10.00 am)
3 JUDGE JORDA: Registrar, would you have the accused brought
4 in, please?
5 (Accused enters court)
6 JUDGE JORDA: Are the three interpretation booths prepared,
7 ready? No problem? All right. Good morning. Does
8 everybody hear me? Does the Prosecutor hear? Does the
9 Defence hear? Mr. Blaskic, do you hear?
10 GENERAL BLASKIC: Good morning. Yes, thank you.
11 JUDGE JORDA: We can resume our hearing. We will sit this
12 morning from 10.00 until 1.00 and since we will be
13 working from 10.00 all of next week, except for Friday,
14 this first period was a little bit disturbed as far as
15 the schedule goes, but without any further ado, since
16 everybody has identified himself and we know one another
17 anyway, I therefore suggest that the Prosecutor take the
18 floor and tell us which witness you intend to bring in
20 MR. KEHOE: Good morning, Mr. President. Good morning, your
22 JUDGE JORDA: Morning.
23 MR. KEHOE: This morning I intend to call Mr. Simon Leach.
24 Your Honour, as Mr. Leach is being brought into the
25 courtroom, I wish to inform the court that we intended
1 to present an expert witness this morning, but because
2 of scheduling problems he was not able to arrive
3 today. He will be available here on Monday. If
4 Mr. Leach has not concluded his testimony, which I do not
5 anticipate he would, I would ask the indulgence of the
6 court to break his testimony so the expert could be
7 heard, and thereafter we could resume with Mr. Leach.
8 JUDGE JORDA: I hope that the Defence has no objection to
9 that. This is simply so that the trial can move
10 forward quickly, unless you have any objection, but it
11 does seem to me to be a good way to proceed, that when
12 we have -- as a way of avoiding any difficulty in
13 continuing the conduct of the trial.
14 MR. HAYMAN: We are pleased to accommodate the convenience
15 of the witness, your Honour.
16 JUDGE JORDA: Thank you. I would also like to thank the
17 other party for trying to work with the Presiding Judge
18 and the two colleagues so that the trial can move
19 forward without too many interruptions. Prosecutor,
20 would you now please bring in your witness.
21 MR. KEHOE: Thank you very much, your Honour.
22 (Witness enters court)
23 THE WITNESS: My name is Simon Kenneth Martin Leach.
24 Mr. Simon Leach (sworn)
25 Examined by Mr. Harmon
1 JUDGE JORDA: Thank you. Would you please give a headset
2 to the witness? . You may be seated but, Mr. Leach, we
3 need to give you a headset so that you can understand.
4 Mr. Simon Leach, do you hear me?
5 A. Yes, I do.
6 JUDGE JORDA: Very well. Mr. Harmon?
7 MR. HARMON: Thank you, your Honour. Mr. Leach, what is
8 your present occupation?
9 A. I am currently a team leader in the investigator section
10 in the office of the Prosecutor for the international
12 Q. Prior to coming to the Criminal Tribunal, what did you
13 do for a living?
14 A. I was a serving police officer in the British police.
15 Q. Would you please inform the court of your background,
16 your education and your professional experience?
17 A. I was educated through high school and left school at 16
18 years of age. I had a variety of positions before
19 joining the British police in 1979. For a period of
20 four years I was a uniformed officer carrying out
21 general police duties both on mobile patrol and as a
22 foot patrol officer. This was also interspersed with
23 periods of attachments to certain investigative units.
24 In 1984 I was appointed Detective Constable as an
25 investigator. I served for two years as an
1 investigator in the east Lancashire town of
2 Accrington. Thereafter I moved to the drug squad, to
3 investigate narcotics and drugs investigations. This
4 involved investigations both locally, nationally and
5 internationally. After two years with the Drugs Squad
6 in 1988 I was promoted to Detective Sergeant, which gave
7 me responsibility for investigative teams. Again, we
8 would cover the general spectrum of criminal offences,
9 crimes of dishonesty, crimes of violence, armed robbery,
10 murder and the like. After three and a half years as a
11 Detective Sergeant operating in a local station I then
12 moved to a unit called the Crime Support Unit. This is
13 a unit dedicated to the investigation of serious
14 criminal offences. I worked with that unit for two and
15 a half years. I investigated and was sent to various
16 European countries on investigations, which included
17 France, Spain, Germany, Italy and the British province
18 of Gibraltar. I was subsequently promoted to inspector
19 and I was then back into uniform and given
20 responsibility for divisional area with a team of five
21 to six sergeants and 30 constables with a variety of
22 responsibilities for general policing of the area of
23 several towns, including criminal matters. In 1994 I
24 went to the Home Office after short listing for an
25 interview for a post here in the Tribunal as a team
1 leader. After interview at the Home Office I was
2 subsequently selected to join the Tribunal and came to
3 the Tribunal in October 1994.
4 Q. Mr. Leach, could you describe your duties and
5 responsibilities since you have been here at the
7 A. After arriving at the Tribunal, my main area of
8 responsibility has been to co-ordinate the investigations
9 in relation to events in Central Bosnia. That is done
10 in conjunction with investigators, military analysts,
11 analysts, researchers and legal officers, who give legal
12 direction to the team.
13 Q. As the team leader and as an investigator, Mr. Leach,
14 have you travelled to Central Bosnia?
15 A. I have been to Central Bosnia on at least 15 to 20
16 occasions in the last two and a half to three years.
17 Q. If I could ask the usher please, your Honour, to pass
18 this map to Mr. Dubuisson, I would ask that be marked
19 exhibit number 26, your Honour. I have copies for the
20 convenience of the court and counsel, which I will now
21 pass out. That, your Honour, represents a smaller
22 version of exhibit number 26. Mr. Leach, what is the
23 source of exhibit number 26?
24 A. This is a map, the opstina map of Bosnia and
25 Herzegovina. It is produced by the Director General of
1 Military Surveyor at the Ministry of Defence in the
2 United Kingdom. I believe the source for the Director
3 General is an organisation called the Vojno Geografska
4 Institute, which I think is an institute from the former
6 Q. When you use the term "opstina", what you do you mean by
8 A. Municipality.
9 Q. Now that shows a number of municipalities, does it not,
10 Mr. Leach?
11 A. Yes, it does.
12 Q. To your right there's a pointer. Could you please
13 point out the area of Central Bosnia on that map?
14 A. The area of Central Bosnia that we have been
15 investigating in the Tribunal is generally this area
16 here. The central point would be the town of Zenica
17 and the surrounding municipalities.
18 Q. Could you point out to the court, Mr. Leach, the
19 municipalities of Vitez, Busovaca and Kiseljak?
20 A. Vitez municipality is here. You may see a blue "YJ"
21 just next to the name of Vitez, just underneath.
22 JUDGE JORDA: Could we move the easel a little bit to the
23 right so that the Defence doesn't have to go through
24 gymnastics in order to see it, so that he can see it
25 better and also that we can see it better on the
1 screens. Yes, that's better. Thank you.
2 MR. HARMON: Your Honour, I would ask that exhibit number 26
3 be admitted into evidence.
4 JUDGE JORDA: If there is no objection from the Defence, we
5 can have it admitted into evidence.
6 MR. HARMON: I would ask the usher to pass the following
7 exhibit, which would be number 27, to Mr. Dubuisson. If
8 that could be put on the ELMO. Mr. Leach, exhibit
9 number 27 appears also to be a map of Bosnia and
10 Herzegovina divided by opstina, does it not?
11 A. Yes, it is, yes.
12 Q. On Exhibit 27 there appears to be in the centre of
13 Bosnia and Herzegovina an area marked in yellow; is that
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. Can you please explain what that is?
17 A. The area marked in yellow is the area that is known as
18 the Central Bosnia operative zone. This is the
19 military zone which fell under the command of General
20 Blaskic pre-November of 1992. It consisted of 22
21 municipalities. Those were the municipalities of
22 Bugojno, Gornji Vakuf, Prozor, Jablanica, Konjic, Novi
23 Travnik, Travnik, Zenica, Jajce, Vitez, Busovaca,
24 Kresevo, Kiseljak, Jarice, Kakanj, Fojnica, Zepce,
25 Teslan, Zavidovici, Maglaj, Teslic and two small suburbs
1 of Sarajevo, which you will notice are circled
2 separately, called Stup and Krazinica.
3 Q. Your Honour, if I could have the usher please take the
4 next exhibit, which I would ask be marked as
5 Exhibit 28. Mr. Leach, do you recognise exhibit number
7 A. Yes, I do.
8 Q. Can you explain to the court what it is?
9 A. In early November 1992 there was a reorganisation of the
10 HVO, which meant that five municipalities which had
11 previously come under the command of General Blaskic no
12 longer fell under his area of operations. He lost
13 command responsibility for the municipalities of
14 Bugojno, Gornji Vakuf, Prozor, Jablanica and Konjic.
15 You will notice note on the overhead and the map you
16 have in front of you, your Honours, that there is a
17 shaded area for the municipality of Jajce. This
18 municipality for all intents and purposes fell out of
19 command and control of General Blaskic in late November
20 1992 after it was taken by the army of the Republika
21 Srpska, the VRS.
22 Q. Could you point out the municipality of Jajce on exhibit
23 number 28, please?
24 A. (Pointing).
25 Q. Thank you. Mr. Leach, did the area in yellow represent
1 the amount of territory that was in General Blaskic's
2 area of control or does it represent something else?
3 MR. HAYMAN: Your Honour.
4 JUDGE JORDA: Yes, Mr. Hayman.
5 MR. HAYMAN: The questioning has changed from command to
6 area of control, and I would pose a foundation objection
7 to testimony by this witness about control unless there
8 is any basis for him to offer an opinion as to what
9 territory or terrain was under the control of General
11 JUDGE JORDA: Just a moment, please. (Pause.) We have
12 deliberated, because this is a question of principle,
13 and the Tribunal has decided that the witness was
14 expressing himself freely as a prosecution witness, and
15 therefore, Mr. Hayman, you will be able to contest
16 anything you wish when you cross-examine during your
17 questioning, and in that way you will be able to direct
18 him in a different way. You can contest this point,
19 which I understand might be important. So the witness
20 can now continue and express himself as he wishes,
21 according to the questions asked by the Prosecution.
22 MR. HARMON: Mr. Leach, could you answer the question I just
24 A. Yes. The area you see excluding Jajce after November
25 1992 displays for you the area, if you will, of
1 responsibility based on a geographical area, in turn
2 based on the municipalities indicated. It is not a
3 true reflection of the area of control, because there
4 will have been areas particularly to the north in the
5 municipalities of Teslic, Teslan, Maglaj and Zavidovici
6 which will have been under the control of other armies
7 and not the HVO.
8 Q. Your Honour, I would ask that Exhibits 27 and 28 be
9 admitted into evidence. Then I would ask the usher to
10 present the next Prosecutor's exhibit, which is a large
11 map. My assistant can point it out to him.
12 Additionally, your Honours, I have copies of this map
13 that I can provide to the court and to counsel. I have
14 copies as well, your Honour, and they are to my left.
15 The smaller, lighter roll, is for the Defence and the
16 heavier roll is for the court.
17 JUDGE JORDA: Objections that the judges get a heavier roll
18 and you are getting a lighter one? No. That's good.
19 Thank you so much. Is that marked Exhibit 19 now?
20 Thank you. Mr. Leach, what is the source of this
21 particular map?
22 A. This is another map which was originally provided for
23 sourced to the Vojna Geografska Institute. Thereafter
24 it was reproduced by a military surveyor UK for the use
25 of UNPROFOR, when they first started to operate in
1 Bosnia and Herzegovina.
2 Q. Now I would like you to take us through a tour of this
3 particular region using that map. First of all,
4 Mr. Leach, does this map reflect areas in the Vitez,
5 Busovaca and Kiseljak municipalities?
6 A. Yes, it does. Vitez is indicated at this point
8 Q. You are pointing for the record to the top part of the
9 map. Let me just ask you one additional question.
10 You mentioned UNPROFOR. What is UNPROFOR?
11 A. UNPROFOR was the United Nations Protection Forces which
12 were sent into the region to assist in peace-keeping and
13 the delivery of food aid throughout the areas of
14 Bosnia-Herzegovina and areas of Croatia as well.
15 Q. Now does that map also include portions of the Zenica
17 A. Yes, it does. (Pointing).
18 Q. You are pointing now to the city of Zenica; is that
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. Mr. Leach, could you just take us through some of the
22 salient locations in that map. If you do so slowly.
23 Thank you.
24 A. I have already indicated to you the town of Vitez, which
25 was the main town for the municipality of Vitez. The
1 other two main areas which are subject of the indictment
2 are the municipalities of Busovaca and Kiseljak. I
3 will now show you the municipality and the town of
4 Busovaca (pointing). Kiseljak is in a south-eastern
5 direction towards the bottom portion of your map to the
6 right (pointing).
7 Q. If you could just hold the pointer there for a minute.
8 JUDGE SHAHABUDDEEN: Mr. Prosecutor, what is the witness
9 pointing to?
10 A. That is the town of Kiseljak, which is the centre --
11 JUDGE SHAHABUDDEEN: Kiss ...
12 A. Kiseljak, which is the town and the municipality of
14 Q. Please proceed, Mr. Leach.
15 A. I will now show you a series of records that were used
16 by UNPROFOR, by the warring parties in the region and
17 were the main mobile communication links in this area.
18 The main road from the south of -- from
19 Herzegovina, which food aid would travel through to
20 Central Bosnia would commence in the south, from the
21 area of Megovic and Mostar, which is not indicated on
22 this map, but the route is this way through the town of
23 Prozor to the town of Gornji Vakuf. The road then went
24 to a very treacherous mountain area, and at that point
25 you reach the town of Novi Travnik, which is shown on
1 your map as Pucarvo.
2 Q. Would you spell that, please?
3 A. P-U-C-A-R-V-O. From Novi Travnik you can go to the
4 junction of the main highway between Travnik and
5 Zenica. So I will now show you the main highway from
6 Travnik to Zenica. As you can see, the main highway
7 travels through the town of Vitez.
8 The next location I would bring to your attention
9 is what we refer to in the team as the Busovaca
10 T-junction, which is here.
11 Q. The Busovaca T-junction is what, Mr. Leach?
12 A. At this junction if you turn right, if you were
13 travelling from Vitez, you would then start to travel
14 towards the town of Busovaca and then through down to
15 the town of Kiseljak. It is one of the main roads, the
16 main communication links for the whole region. I'll
17 now show you the route from the Busovaca T-junction. I
18 will stop the pointer at Busovaca and then follow down
19 through the town of Kiseljak (pointing).
20 Q. You are holding the pointer now at the town of Kiseljak;
21 is that correct?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. Would you follow that route one more time, Mr. Leach,
24 please, with your pointer?
25 A. I'll follow the route again from Vitez to the Busovaca
1 T-junction, to Busovaca, to Kiseljak (pointing). This
2 is Vitez, Busovaca T-junction, which may be marked on
3 your maps with the word "Kaonik"; south to Busovaca and
4 then south-east to Kiseljak.
5 Q. Mr. Leach, while you are standing, in what direction is
7 A. Sarajevo, if the map were larger, would be in this area
8 here (pointing).
9 Q. Now, Mr. Leach, on that particular map, Exhibit 29, there
10 are a number of locations marked or highlighted in
11 orange. Can you explain what those are?
12 A. Yes. These are locations of villages which were
13 attacked during the conflict between the HVO and the
14 army of Bosnia-Herzegovina. I'll start at the west or
15 the left-hand side of the map and work to the right, to
16 the easterly side of the map (pointing).
17 That location is Veceriska. The next location is
18 Gacice. You then have the town of Vitez itself.
19 Following the main highway you have Santici. Above
20 Santici on the map you have Behrici. If you follow
21 further down the road an inch and a half you then have
22 Ahmici and Nadioci, followed by the village of
23 Loncari. At the location I referred to as the Busovaca
24 T-junction you have the former JNA barracks called
25 Kaonik. If I then go south-west to the Kiseljak
1 municipality, starting at the north of Kiseljak, there
2 is the village of Svinjarevo; just at the south, Perici;
3 just to the south again, Gromiljak -- sorry --
4 Gomionica; to the south again Gromiljak; to the south
5 again Polje Visnjica and then south-west, Visnjica. To
6 the south of Visnjica is Rotilj and directly east is
7 Kiseljak town itself. If you travel the road south
8 towards Sarajevo, you have Han Ploca and Grahovci, and
9 directly south finally Tulica.
10 Q. Mr. Leach, those towns and villages that are marked in
11 orange do not represent all of the towns and villages
12 that were attacked by the HVO, do they?
13 A. No, they do not.
14 Q. Now --
15 JUDGE SHAHABUDDEEN: May I ask about Sevreno in the Vitez
16 area. Did you mention Sevreno? It's highlighted.
17 A. No, I did not, because that's not within the indictment,
19 JUDGE SHAHABUDDEEN: I see.
20 MR. HARMON: Mr. Leach, you have previously described the
21 road. You have been on those roads many times, have you
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. Now the roads between Vitez and Kiseljak, along that
25 road there are a number of villages that are highlighted
1 in orange. Are many of those villages visible from
2 that main route?
3 A. Apart from the village of Tulica to the south and
4 portions of Rotilj to the west of Kiseljak, and also
5 Loncari and Putis, all other locations are either
6 exactly on the roadside where the village starts to
7 exist or they are just one or two kilometres from the
8 roadside and are quite clearly visible to all.
9 Q. Your Honours, I would move into evidence exhibit
10 number 29.
11 MR. HAYMAN: May I be heard, your Honour? My only concern
12 is if there are some --
13 JUDGE JORDA: Mr. Hayman, we are listening to you. I'm not
14 sure we can hear you but we're listening. Please
16 MR. HAYMAN: My only concern is if there is some confusion
17 about which villages are mentioned in the indictment and
18 have been highlighted, that that be clarified before the
19 map be admitted.
20 JUDGE JORDA: What confusion, Mr. Hayman? Could you be a
21 little clearer?
22 MR. HAYMAN: Well, Judge Shahabuddeen enquired about the
23 village of Sevreno, which is apparently highlighted in
24 orange, but which is not named in the indictment. I
25 just think for clarity it would be good to be
1 consistent. I think there was testimony the
2 highlighted villages were the ones named in the
3 indictment. Now apparently that's not the case with
4 respect to at least one. If that could be clarified, I
5 think that would be helpful to all of us.
6 JUDGE JORDA: Yes. The objection is sustained. Therefore
7 if the exhibit is going to be admitted, it should be
8 first corrected and only then admitted. Therefore, I
9 propose that for the moment this exhibit will be
10 returned to the Registry and will be resubmitted later,
11 when the Tribunal will admit it once it has been
12 corrected. You can continue.
13 MR. HARMON: Thank you, your Honour. Mr. Leach, that's a
14 very large map next to you, but the area that's depicted
15 in that map, is it a very large area in your opinion?
16 A. No, from the town of Vitez to Kiseljak, when you were
17 travelling by road, not as the crow flies just by road,
18 is less than 50 kms.
19 Q. Your Honour, I have two clear plastic overlays for that
20 particular map, and I would ask that they be identified
21 as Exhibit 29A and 29B.
22 JUDGE JORDA: Under the same reservation, Mr. Prosecutor,
23 the objection that was sustained. We will see what
24 this overlay will show.
25 MR. HARMON: I would ask that Mr. Leach assist the usher in
1 mounting those on the exhibit. Your Honour, for the
2 assistance of the court and counsel I now have something
3 else that I would like to present to the court, and it
4 is essentially a copy of the map as it now appears with
5 those concentric circles over each location.
6 THE REGISTRAR: Would you like them to be numbered
7 separately as exhibits number 30 and 31.
8 MR. HARMON: Or they could be marked 29C and D.
9 THE REGISTRAR: Okay.
10 JUDGE JORDA: Is the question of numbers clear so that
11 during the cross-examination we all understand what we
12 are talking about regarding the exhibits? 29C will be
13 the one referring to the zone to the south, the zone of
14 Vitez. The area of Vitez will be 29C and the area of
15 Kiseljak will then be 29D. Are we in agreement? Is
16 that correct?
17 MR. HARMON: Mr. Leach, why do not we start with 29C? First
18 of all, Mr. Leach, can you explain what this is, 29C?
19 A. Yes, your Honours. 29C is the plastic overlay on the
20 large map. The centre point for the overlap is in the
21 town of Vitez and is as accurately as possible placed on
22 the Hotel Vitez, which was the headquarters of General
23 Blaskic during the period of the indictment. The rings
24 then each depict a distance of 1 km as you leave the
25 centre point of the Hotel Vitez.
1 Q. Were distances taken by the office of the Prosecutor to
2 various locations in respect of this investigation,
3 Mr. Leach?
4 A. Yes. A large number of distances have been travelled by
5 investigators in my team. This has been done by car,
6 using the Hotel Vitez as the centre point and then
7 travelling on the most accessible route, either main
8 road or side road, to certain village locations on the
10 Q. Now, Mr. Leach, will you just for the court's benefit
11 describe the various locations that are indicated on
12 Exhibit 29C? That is the distances between the Hotel
13 Vitez and the locations that you will testify about?
14 A. The first distance is from the Hotel Vitez to the
15 village of Ahmici (pointing).
16 Q. You are talking via the main road; is that correct?
17 A. That is via the main road from Vitez to the main highway
18 between Travnik and Zenica. That's a distance of
19 4.8 kms.
20 Q. Please continue.
21 A. The next location is the village of Gacice to the west
22 of Vitez. That is a distance of 1.9 kms.
23 Q. Will you point that out on the map, please?
24 A. (Pointing). The next location is the village of
25 Veceriska, which is a distance of 3.9 kms (pointing).
1 JUDGE JORDA: Mr. Hayman, you have an objection?
2 MR. HAYMAN: I apologise for interrupting counsel and the
3 witness but the witness is reading from some kind of a
4 document. He has a blue bound folder. The problem
5 with witnesses taking documents up to the witness stand
6 and utilising them in their testimony in secret is it's
7 a form of secret communication between the Prosecutor
8 and the witness, if, in fact, the Prosecutor has the
9 document or has seen it. I object to witnesses taking
10 documents up to the witness stand without having them
11 known to court and to counsel.
12 JUDGE JORDA: Yes, Mr. Hayman. You know that in the first
13 week we are going to deal with many problems of
14 principle, and we hope to make progress in a positive
15 sense. I must say that as far as I am concerned, it
16 seems to me to be rather difficult to ask a witness to
17 come with his hands in his pockets and to answer such
18 complex questions. You know that after all if he knew
19 all that by heart, it would boil down to the same
20 thing. So I do not think it is a fundamental
21 objection. If a witness has a document he is like any
22 other person. His memory may fail him, and so he needs
23 some documents. If those documents are tele-guided by
24 the Prosecutor, I think that's very difficult to answer
25 that question. You can't answer it and I can't
1 either. Nonetheless I will ask my colleagues and
2 consult them, but I would appeal to you to allow the
3 witnesses to express themselves and to have some
4 confidence in them, and after that you can question them
5 as much as you wish, but allow me to consult my
6 colleagues first, because during this week we need to
7 regulate certain matters regarding the conduct of the
8 debates at this hearing. (Pause.)
9 We are trying to adjust to different judicial
10 cultures. The Tribunal has tried to make a distinction
11 between what are personal notes -- every individual has
12 his way of preparing himself for a hearing -- and, on
13 the other hand, documents which have to be common to
14 all, and which the Prosecutor has knowledge of. If
15 this document that Mr. Leach has on his table -- if it is
16 a document known to the Prosecution, then the Tribunal
17 feels it agrees with the Defence and it should be
18 conveyed to the Defence. If these are personal notes
19 and the witness will tell us under oath they are
20 personal notes intended to help him personally during
21 his testimony, which, as we see, will last for several
22 hours, if they are personal notes, then the Tribunal
23 feels that they belong to Mr. Simon Leach and he may use
25 Therefore, my question is, Mr. Simon Leach, whether
1 the document identified by the Defence as being on your
2 table, is it a document that the Prosecutor is familiar
3 with? Yes or no?
4 A. Yes, it is.
5 JUDGE JORDA: It is a document that you drew up with the
6 Prosecutor or at least that the Prosecutor was aware of?
7 A. The Prosecutor is aware of it. It is an aide memoire
8 so I am aware of what exhibits will come in what
9 order. Interspersed into that are my own personal
10 notes so that I can then refresh my memory on factual
11 things such as distances, the names of municipalities,
12 etc. It's an aide memoire for me.
13 JUDGE JORDA: Now this is a different situation. It is a
14 document established with the Prosecutor as well as
15 being an aide memoire at the same time. (Pause.)
16 In accordance with our position, this document
17 will be communicated to the Defence.
18 MR. HARMON: Thank you, your Honour. Now, Mr. Leach, will
19 you please continue with your --
20 JUDGE JORDA: Just a moment, please. (Pause.) Very
21 well. The document will be communicated to the
22 Defence, but it will not be admitted as evidence for the
23 Tribunal. You may proceed, Mr. Prosecutor.
24 MR. HARMON: Mr. Leach, we were discussing Exhibit 29C.
25 Could you continue, please, and advise the Trial Chamber
1 and counsel the distances in relation to various
2 locations on that map?
3 A. Yes, your Honours. I'd previously pointed out the
4 village of Ahmici at 4.8 kms and the village of Gacice
5 at 1.9 kms. The next location is Visnjica at 3.9 kms.
6 Q. Again travelling from Hotel Vitez; is that correct?
7 A. Yes, again travelling from the Hotel Vitez.
8 Q. Please continue.
9 A. The next location is the village of Santici, which is
10 4.4 kms from the Hotel Vitez. The next location is the
11 village of Behrici, which is 5 kms from the Hotel Vitez.
12 JUDGE RIAD: Behrici?
13 A. Yes, Behrici.
14 JUDGE RIAD: Where is it?
15 A. On the map, sir, it's just north, about 1 and a half
16 cms, from Santici. The next location is the village of
17 Nadioci, which is to the east of Ahmici, and 6 kms from
18 the Hotel Vitez.
19 MR. HARMON: Please continue.
20 A. The next location is the Busovaca T-junction, which I
21 must apologise to the court. I do not have my notes
22 with me for this, but I can show the location.
23 (Pointing). You can see from the concentric rings that
24 it is approximately 9 kms from the Hotel Vitez.
25 Q. Shall we now turn to Exhibit 29D, Mr. Leach, and could
1 you please repeat the exercise?
2 JUDGE JORDA: Just a minute, please. (Pause.) You may
4 A. Yes, your Honour. If I may correct my previous answer,
5 I do have a supporting aide-memoire with me, which
6 obviously the Defence will get. The distance from the
7 Hotel Vitez to Kaonik Prison is 10.6 kms. Obviously
8 the difference on the concentric circles is because the
9 concentric circles is a direct route as the crow
10 flies. The 10.6 kms is as you would travel by car.
11 Q. Can we now turn to Exhibit 29D?
12 A. This is the same methodology which is applied --
13 JUDGE JORDA: Excuse me. This simply means, Mr. Harmon,
14 that the map which was prepared very carefully does not
15 allow us to use it -- does not allow us to use the scale
16 indicated on the map, because the distance are
17 calculated differently on the ground. I'm sorry.
18 Perhaps it would have been simpler to have said how many
19 kms Kaonik was away from such and such a point because
20 here you have concentric circles but if you calculate in
21 west to east you do not come up with the same
22 differences. You yourself had to correct yourself, Mr.
23 Simon Leach. I am not reproaching you for anything.
24 You paid a lot of attention in doing it. I want to make
25 the proper estimates because I was very carefully trying
1 to make calculations of the kilometres and it did not
2 match. Therefore I think the simplest thing to do or
3 say is to say, as in all countries, that Kaonik has to
4 be so many kilometres from the other place using the
5 most direct route. I'm just making a simple comment.
6 MR. HARMON: Fine. Thank you. Mr. Leach, would you turn
7 to 29D now, which is the southern most set of concentric
8 circles. Would you please first of all indicate what
9 is the centre point in 29D?
10 A. The centre point for Exhibit 29D is the former JNA
11 barracks which was the Kiseljak barracks, which was
12 under the control of the HVO and also a headquarters of
13 General Blaskic at the time.
14 Q. And the distances in that particular exhibit, is that
15 also 1 km distances between the concentric rings?
16 A. Yes, it is.
17 Q. All right. Mr. Leach, would you please now describe to
18 the court the distances by car between certain locations
19 indicated in orange on 29D?
20 A. Yes, your Honours. The distance from the Kiseljak
21 barracks to Svinjarevo is 7.3 kms.
22 Q. Svinjarevo is the mark that's located at the top of the
23 exhibit, around 6 km mark; is that correct?
24 A. It is, yes.
25 Q. The next location is that of Behrici.
1 JUDGE JORDA: To go back to what I was saying, all of this
2 may be cross-examined. Just tell us simply that these
3 concentric circles allow you to make specific estimates,
4 at least more or less specific. Simply tell us how far
5 are these -- what are the distances of these points
6 marked in orange on the map? Those to the east are
7 further away than what is shown in your concentric
8 circles. So I think we go a little bit more quickly to
9 explain this. Tell us very quickly how far away about
10 Kiseljak was from the 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 8 or 9 locations
11 which I have indicated on the map. I think that would
12 be easier and then we can ask questions that are asked
13 so as to speed things up a bit. (Pause.) Go ahead.
14 MR. HARMON: The concentric circles are not to confuse the
15 Chamber as to the distances travelled by car, but as the
16 Chamber will hear later on, parts of the geography of
17 this area is flat. So those concentric circles
18 represent the distances by sight to those particular
19 locations. That's the relevance of the circles, but
20 they are not to be confused with the distances travelled
21 by road. I'm very happy to proceed to have Mr. Leach
22 continue by giving you the distance by road to these
23 particular locations.
24 A. I'll start again, your Honour -- should I -- from
25 Kiseljak Barracks to Svinjarevo is 7.3 kms; the barracks
1 to Behrici is 6.5 kms; the barracks to Gomionica is 6.6
2 kms; to Gromiljak is 3.3 kms; to Rotilj is 4.6 kms;
3 Polje Visnjica, 4.2 kms.
4 JUDGE JORDA: Yes. Go on.
5 A. Visnjica 5.2 kms. Ploca 8.8 kms. I do not have a
6 reading for Tulica. The reason for that is on a visit
7 to that area we have been informed by both IFOR and SFOR
8 that there's a possibility of mines and therefore it is
9 not safe to go there.
10 Q. What's IFOR and SFOR?
11 A. They are the current stabilising forces in
13 JUDGE SHAHABUDDEEN: Some of these places had barracks and
14 some did not?
15 A. The centre point for the second exhibit, your Honour,
16 this exhibit (pointing), there's only one barracks
17 indicated on that exhibit. That is the Kiseljak
18 Barracks, which was under the control of the HVO, and
19 that was a former JNA barracks before the conflict.
20 JUDGE SHAHABUDDEEN: That was the only location which had
22 A. As far as I'm aware, yes.
23 MR. HARMON: Your Honour, I would ask that Exhibit 29D be
24 admitted into evidence. 29D does not have the
25 offensive orange marked on a village that was not
2 JUDGE RIAD: I would just like to comment on a point of
3 visibility. Is it flat completely? Is the area flat?
4 A. The two exhibits do differ substantially, your Honour.
5 In the case of Kiseljak and the Kiseljak Barracks, it is
6 highly unlikely, if impossible, to see the locations
7 marked as a town, although during a conflict when, for
8 example, smoke may be rising, you may be able to see the
9 smoke, but line of sight to the hill where the village
10 is situated I would say not. Alternatively, if you
11 return to the previous exhibit for Vitez, on my personal
12 visits you can stand in the town of Vitez. You can
13 quite clearly see Gacice, Veceriska, Santici and Behrici
14 from the town of Vitez itself. Those villages and
15 locations are quite clearly identifiable. Therefore
16 the concentric rings are even more valuable for you
18 JUDGE JORDA: I think that we're going to suspend the
19 hearing and we will resume at 11.30.
20 (11.15 am)
21 (Short break)
23 JUDGE JORDA: We can resume the hearing. I would like to
24 have the accused brought in, please.
25 (Accused enters court)
1 JUDGE JORDA: Mr. Harmon?
2 MR. HARMON: Yes, your Honour. If I could have the usher
3 please take Exhibit 30. I would ask that to be marked
4 as Exhibit 30 by Mr. Dubuisson. I would appreciate
6 JUDGE JORDA: Go ahead.
7 MR. HARMON: Mr. Leach, before you use Exhibit 30, can you
8 explain to the court the source of the map of the
10 A. It is a general autoroute map produced by the Shell
11 Company. It is a scale of 1:250,000.
12 Q. There seems to be an overlay on that map. Would you
13 indicate what that is?
14 A. These are the overlays which are equivalent in size to
15 the first exhibit, the first opstina, municipality map
16 that you were shown at the very beginning of my
18 Q. Mr. Leach, is that an overlay of the Central Bosnia
19 operation zone after 1972, November -- 1992, I'm sorry?
20 A. Yes. That's an outline and then the individual
21 municipalities within the Central Bosnia operational
22 zone post-November-1992.
23 Q. What is indicated in orange?
24 A. The orange indicates where the municipalities of Vitez,
25 Busovaca and Kiseljak would be.
1 Q. Now could you please remove the overlay with the orange
2 from Exhibit 30? Now, your Honour, I have a smaller
3 version of what is depicted in part of that map, and I
4 would ask that that be distributed to counsel and to the
5 court. Would you put that on the ELMO, please,
6 Mr. Leach? Mr. Leach, could you orient the court as to
7 particular features on that map?
8 A. Yes, your Honours. To the bottom left-hand corner of
9 the map you see the city of Den Haag, where we are
10 now. That is a representation within there. Going up
11 the map is the municipality of Kiseljak, which goes as
12 far as Leiden. You then have what would be the
13 municipality of Busovaca, where you can see the town of
14 Nieuw-Vennep, followed by the municipality of Vitez,
15 which would end just before the city of Amsterdam, but
16 would go as far as Schipol Airport.
17 Q. Mr. President, I would ask that Exhibit 30 and 30A be
18 admitted to evidence.
19 MR. HAYMAN: No objection to Exhibit 30, your Honour, if
20 there's a foundation that the two maps are of the same
21 scale. I do not think we have heard that yet.
22 MR. HARMON: Mr. Leach, can you answer that question?
23 A. As far as I'm aware they are of the same scale. The
24 opstina map that was used to draw the overlay is of the
25 same scale but I'll check my notes. (Pause) I
1 understand they are of the same scale but I cannot be
3 JUDGE JORDA: Are you satisfied with that answer,
4 Mr. Hayman?
5 MR. HAYMAN: Perhaps the court could enquire what map, if
6 it's an exhibit, the overlay of the Bosnian area came
7 from and then that might help. It is not clear in my
8 mind that they are the same scale. They may well be
9 but I just do not know.
10 A. I understand it's come from the Bosnian opstina map but
11 I didn't prepare the overlay myself.
12 MR. HARMON: I can present evidence to the court on that
13 later, your Honour.
14 JUDGE JORDA: Mr. Harmon, do you want to -- I didn't quite
15 understand your answer. Would you like to clarify it,
17 MR. HARMON: I do not have the specific map and I can't
18 reference the specific map today, your Honour, or this
19 morning. I can at a later hearing. They are from
20 maps of the same scale, however.
21 JUDGE JORDA: For the time being we will see that map 30
22 does not cause you any problems for its being put into
23 the record. Which one are you asking questions about?
24 30A,; Mr. Hayman?
25 MR. HAYMAN: I think 30 is the map before the witness. If
1 I understand the witness' testimony properly, the
2 question is: is Exhibit 28 also of the scale of
3 1:250,000? It may indicate on the copy that was
4 tendered to the Registrar. I do not know.
5 MR. HARMON: Again, your Honour, I do not have that
6 information at my fingertips. I can present that
7 information to the court at a later time.
8 JUDGE JORDA: All right. The Tribunal will wait to have
9 the exhibits put into the record until we have clarified
10 the point. In the meantime, let us continue?
11 A. Your Honour, if I may just assist the court, if
12 Mr. Hayman refers to the notes, -- the copy of my notes,
13 page 1, the Bosnia-Herzegovina opstina map says "Scale
14 1:500,000". If you refer to the map of Holland Shell,
15 page 6, the scale is 1:500,000 so they are the same
17 MR. HAYMAN: That's fine, though the witnessed testified
18 that the map of Holland was 1:250,000, so that was
19 perhaps the source of my confusion.
20 JUDGE JORDA: Mr. Hayman, for the time being we will take
21 note of your confusion. You can save your objections
22 until you cross-examine. In the time being the
23 Tribunal will agree to postponing of the exhibit being
24 put into the record until next week, when the Prosecutor
25 brings us clarifications. If the clarifications are
1 insufficient you can draw whatever conclusions you
2 choose to during your cross-examination. Now I would
3 like to give the floor back to the Prosecutor.
4 MR. HARMON: Your Honour, I would like this following
5 exhibit marked Exhibit 31. Mr. Leach, what is exhibit
7 JUDGE JORDA: Just one moment, please. I have been asked
8 a question by the Registrar. Could you -- we'd like to
9 know whether this overlay has been recorded as 30B -- D
10 -- I'm sorry. 30D. I'm talking now about the
11 overlay. I believe that it is part of -- an integral
12 part of 30, which for the time being has not been
13 admitted as an exhibit. Yes. Is this an integral part
14 of 30A, Mr. Dubuisson, in which case it would also not be
15 put in as evidence until you -- or do you consider it
16 should be put in as an exhibit? Mr. Hayman, what do you
17 think? Would you prefer that it be part of that other
18 exhibit until we come to our definite conclusions?
19 MR. HAYMAN: I would think it should be 30A or 30B. I
20 would guess 30A since there is only one other map an
22 JUDGE JORDA: You have no problem with its being put in as
23 an exhibit then?
24 MR. HAYMAN: Until we know its scale, I would suggest that
25 it stay together with Exhibit 30.
1 JUDGE JORDA: I agree that's more logical. For 30A --
2 turning to the Registrar, come help me for a moment.
3 These are pieces for the time being -- the pieces we are
4 not putting in are 30A-D, is that --
5 THE REGISTRAR: No, the parts put in abeyance is the map on
6 the easel, which is map 30. The little map which is
7 attached is 30A, which is being postponed -- being put
8 into the record is being postponed.
9 JUDGE JORDA: Since there is the problem of scale with all
10 three documents for the time being we will hold all
11 three in abeyance. You can continue with the map you
12 have there, Mr. Leach, in order to answer the questions.
13 MR. HARMON: I have reproductions of this as well, your
14 Honour, for the court and counsel.
15 JUDGE JORDA: If we all agree, as far as the numbering is
16 concerned, the large map will be 31 and the one which
17 has been tendered to the judges will be 31A, that's the
18 smaller one. Do we agree to that before we know whether
19 we are going to bring them in as evidence? Everybody
20 does agree. All right. We can continue.
21 MR. HARMON: Mr. Leach, what is the source of 31?
22 A. The source of this map is the Cartographic Institute in
23 Den Haag, which is indicated actually on the map, your
25 Q. Would you explain this exhibit, please, Mr. Leach?
1 A. The concentric circles that you can see on the map are
2 representative of a distance of 1 km between each
3 circle. Indicated on the map are a variety of
4 locations by letter, letter A being the Hotel Vitez;
5 letter B thereafter being the village of Ahmici; C, the
6 village of Santici; D, the village of Gacice; E, the
7 village of Sivrino Selo; F, the village of Donje
8 Veceriska. G is what we would call the front line
9 entry point in Stari Vitez. H is the site of a truck
10 bomb explosion which occurred in the afternoon of 18th
11 April 1993 in Stari Vitez. I is what is described as
12 an exit point from Stari Vitez. J is the village of
14 Q. In the map of The Hague what is the centre point A
15 represented by?
16 A. The centre point on the actual map is Central Station,
17 but we refer to this -- we can refer to this as the
18 Hotel Vitez for comparison of distances.
19 Q. Okay. So A is overlaid over the Central Station, train
20 station in The Hague; is that correct?
21 A. That is correct, yes.
22 Q. Then the distances to the various other letters are
23 indicated in the legend which is located in the upper
24 right-hand corner of this map; is that correct?
25 A. That is correct, yes.
1 Q. Okay. So Ahmici, where in The Hague would Ahmici
2 appear, Mr. Leach, from the Central Station?
3 A. From the Central Station Ahmici would appear at point B,
4 which is the pier at Scheveningen.
5 Q. Can you point that out, please?
6 A. (Pointing). That is Central Station or would be
7 General Blaskic's headquarters in Vitez. That is the
8 peer at Scheveningen (pointing) or would the village of
10 Q. Referring to letter C, which is the village of Santici,
11 where in The Hague approximately does the letter C show
13 A. The letter C shows up at the harbour to the east -- the
14 north side of the harbour at Scheveningen.
15 Q. Now, Mr. Leach, turning to Gacice, which is indicated by
16 letter D, where on the map of The Hague does the letter
17 D appear?
18 A. Letter D is just at the car park and the junction of the
19 Peace Palace.
20 Q. Turning to the letter F, which is Donje Veceriska, where
21 on this map does the letter F appear in The Hague?
22 A. It appears on Zwolsestraat, where it joins Van Alkemade-
23 laan, but it is best described being 150-200 metres
24 beyond the prison at Scheveningen.
25 Q. Now could you turn to the letter G, Mr. Leach, and tell
1 me where in The Hague the letter G appears and what is
2 the location?
3 A. G is near to the park and the museum not far from the
4 American Embassy.
5 Q. How far away is that from the Central Station?
6 A. That's 1.9 kms.
7 Q. Will you --
8 A. Sorry. It's 300 metres.
9 Q. Now the letter G that you've just referred to, what did
10 you refer to in the town of Vitez?
11 A. If you were at point A, which would be the Hotel Vitez,
12 as the fighting between the two warring parties
13 commenced on 16th April in Vitez town, a front line, if
14 you will, developed between the two warring parties, and
15 that front line would be indicated at point G.
16 Q. What does point H represent in the town of Vitez?
17 A. Point H represents an incident which occurred on the
18 afternoon of 18th April 1993, where a large truck or van
19 loaded with a substantial amount of explosives exploded
20 inside what had then developed into the Muslim enclave,
21 and this bomb exploded in Stari Vitez.
22 Q. Referring to the map of The Hague, where does that
24 A. That appears to the left side of the Malieveld.
25 Q. Mr. Leach, turning to the --
1 JUDGE RIAD: Would you explain where Malieveld is for the
3 A. If you leave Central Station, your Honour, and I drive
4 towards the beach, there's a very large park on your
5 right, which is often the site for circuses and fairs.
6 The central part of that park or the central entrance to
7 that park would be the Malieveld.
8 JUDGE RIAD: How many metres would that be from the Central
10 A. It's about 400 metres.
11 JUDGE JORDA: Would you go on, please.
12 MR. HARMON: Turning lastly, Mr. Leach, to the letter J, what
13 does that represent in Central Bosnia?
14 A. That represents the village of Nadioci.
15 Q. Where on the map of The Hague does it appear?
16 A. That appears out towards Wassenaar, in between The Hague
17 and Wassenaar on the main highway.
18 Q. Your Honour, I would ask that Exhibits 31 and 31A be
19 admitted into evidence.
20 JUDGE JORDA: Very well. The exhibits have been admitted.
21 MR. HARMON: I would ask that the following exhibit be
22 marked as Exhibit 32. Mr. Leach, I would like to turn
23 to Exhibit 32. Can you first of all identify the
24 source of that particular map?
25 A. Yes. This map has been provided under the auspices of
1 the Director General of the Military Surveyor, Ministry
2 of Defence, United Kingdom, dated May 1993. It's
3 printed by the Military Survey of UK.
4 Q. Will you please explain to the court what Exhibit 31
6 A. This is a town plan of Vitez. I should point out to
7 your Honours that not every single building, not every
8 complete black square or rectangle is representative of
9 every building in the town, but it does give a fairly
10 accurate assessment of the buildings in the town.
11 Q. What is the distance between the concentric rings on
12 that town -- on that map, I'm sorry?
13 A. The concentric rings indicate a distance of 200 metres
14 from one ring to the next.
15 Q. What is the centre point of the first circle?
16 A. The centre point is the Hotel Vitez.
17 Q. Okay. Now, if we could, Mr. Leach, would you please
18 proceed to describe to the court the first location on
19 that map, which would be indicated as letter B, first of
20 all pointing it out to the court?
21 A. The Hotel Vitez would be here at A, your Honours, and B
22 is the Vitez Cinema.
23 Q. What is the Vitez Cinema? Can you explain what it is
24 first of all, Mr. Leach?
25 A. I believe it is a combination of a cinema building and
1 cultural centre that was for the residents of Vitez.
2 Q. Now if I may have these photographs as my next exhibit,
3 your Honour, exhibit number 33, there are 11 photographs
4 in each of the files. Now, Mr. Leach, let me ask you a
5 question in respect of those particular photographs.
6 Have you had a chance to inspect those photographs
7 Exhibit 33?
8 A. Yes, I have.
9 Q. Can you tell me when those photographs were taken and
10 whether you were present at the time those photographs
11 were taken?
12 A. These photographs were taken by two photographers from
13 the Dutch National Police, who were requested to assist
14 the office of the Prosecutor taking photographs of
15 various locations throughout Central Bosnia. These
16 particular photographs were taken on Tuesday, 28th May
18 Q. Okay. Your Honour, I would move to admit Exhibit 33,
19 which is 11 photographs contained in the book I just
20 passed to the court.
21 JUDGE JORDA: Yes, Mr. Hayman.
22 MR. HAYMAN: I think they should be identified first so that
23 we know they are relevant.
24 MR. HARMON: I was intending to do that, your Honour, as I
25 was going to go through the rest of my examination. I
1 can --
2 JUDGE JORDA: Then, Mr. Prosecutor, for the moment we will
3 give them numbers. What are the numbers, Mr. Registrar.
4 THE REGISTRAR: It is exhibit number 33. The first
5 photograph will be 33-1 and so on until 33-... how many
6 are there?
7 MR. HARMON: There are 11.
8 JUDGE JORDA: 33-12 my colleague tells me. Very well,
9 Mr. Prosecutor. Will you identify them, please.
10 MR. HARMON: Mr. Leach, will you identify the photographs in
11 Exhibit 33, please, starting from the top, which is
13 A. PH181, your Honours, is a photograph taken from the
14 front but slightly to the left of the Hotel Vitez, which
15 was the headquarters of General Blaskic.
16 Q. Now would I like to turn to PH186, Mr. Leach. Can you
17 identify that photograph?
18 A. That is a photograph taken directly from the road to the
19 front entrance of the Hotel Vitez.
20 Q. Which was General Blaskic's headquarters in Vitez?
21 A. Yes.
22 JUDGE JORDA: The interpreters are telling me that they
23 would prefer to see the photographs on the ELMO, if that
24 is possible.
25 MR. HARMON: All right.
1 JUDGE JORDA: We are in the stage of identification now.
2 A. Do you wish me to start again at the beginning, your
4 JUDGE JORDA: Yes, I would prefer you to do that so as to
5 facilitate our work. Go on?
6 A. That was the first photograph that was shown, which was
7 PH181, which is the front of the Hotel Vitez taken from
8 the left side of the building. The next photograph --
9 MR. HARMON: Excuse me, your Honour. I think the ELMO has
10 to be adjusted. Thank you.
11 A. The next photograph, PH186, is from the road looking
12 directly at the entrance of the Hotel Vitez, which was
13 General Blaskic's headquarters. The next photograph
14 relevant to General Blaskic headquarters is PH205.
15 This is taken from a pedestrianised walk area where no
16 vehicles are allowed and is to the side of the hotel.
17 One can see the hotel sign at the top of the building.
18 The next photograph I will show you is PH182,
19 which is at the front of your binder. PH182 is a
20 photograph of the telecommunications building, the PTT,
21 which was under the control of the local Bosnian Croats
22 and HVO during the period of the conflict.
23 The next photograph I will refer to I think is the
24 fourth page, PH208.
25 JUDGE JORDA: Indicate the number of the photograph,
1 because they are not in the same order, as far as we can
2 see here?
3 A. It is PH208.
4 MR. HARMON: Which will be found on the last page, your
5 Honour, of your ...
6 A. This is again a second photograph of the PTT building in
8 The next photograph I will show you is on page 2
9 and its number is PH197. This is a photograph --
10 MR. HARMON: Wait a second. That should be on the fifth
11 page of your books, your Honour.
12 JUDGE JORDA: I'm managing to find my way as long as I'm
13 given the number of the photograph.
14 A. This is a photograph taken from the rear of the Cinema
15 building, the cultural centre, slightly off-set to the
16 right, looking back at the building.
17 Q. What is the significance of that building?
18 A. On the morning of 16th April 1993, when the conflict
19 erupted, a large number of Bosnian Muslim civilians from
20 various locations throughout the town of Vitez itself
21 were taken to this building, where they were detained.
22 Q. All right. Please proceed.
23 A. The next photograph, your Honour, is PH198. This is
24 another photograph of the cinema building, but actually
25 shows the entrance door to the building from the side.
1 The next photograph is PH203.
2 Q. Yes. Can you identify it, please?
3 A. Yes. That is the front entrance of what was the
4 headquarters of the local HVO brigade in Vitez, under
5 the command of a man by the name of Mario Cerkez.
6 Q. All right. Could you proceed with the next photograph,
8 A. The next photograph, your Honour, is PH225.
9 Q. What is that photograph?
10 A. That is a photograph taken of a building known as the
11 Vetrinaska Stanista, which is the veterinary station.
12 Q. What is the significance of that location?
13 A. This is a separate location again used on the morning of
14 16th April 1993 where Bosnian Muslim civilians were
15 taken and detained as the conflict started that morning.
16 Q. All right. Could you proceed with the next photograph?
17 A. The next photograph, your Honour, is PH226 and this is
18 another photograph of the same building from the
19 previous picture, the veterinary station.
20 Q. All right, Mr. Leach. Please proceed?
21 A. The final picture is PH212.
22 Q. What is that?
23 A. That is believed to be the location of the premises
24 which are in the ground floor or basement known as the
25 Chess Club.
1 Q. What is the significance of the Chess Club?
2 A. After the conflict on 16th April a large number of
3 Bosnian Muslims were detained in a variety of
4 locations. Over the following days negotiations took
5 place --
6 MR. HAYMAN: Your Honour, I'm afraid I have to object as to
7 foundation. I do not know what the source of this
8 witness' knowledge is for events that clearly he was not
9 present for, if they occurred, because he had not yet
10 become involved in the activities of the Tribunal. I
11 have no objection to him identifying a location, as he
12 was told this was the Chess Club or whatever, and
13 perhaps other witnesses can provide details of events
14 that occurred in the 1992, etc., time period.
15 JUDGE JORDA: Mr. Hayman, I agree with you that the witness
16 certainly did not participate in the events. Will you
17 continue, Mr. Leach.
18 MR. HARMON: Now, your Honour, I would ask that the exhibit,
19 the photo book marked as Exhibit 33, be admitted into
21 JUDGE JORDA: The album will be admitted as evidence.
22 MR. HARMON: Now, Mr. Leach, if we could return, please, to
23 the previous exhibit, which is the Vitez town plan,
24 Exhibit 31, and you had previously identified the Vitez
25 Cinema, both in the photographs and designated by the
1 letter B on the exhibit; is that correct?
2 A. Yes, I did.
3 Q. Okay. Now can you please tell the court the distance
4 from the Hotel Vitez, which was General Blaskic's
5 headquarters, to the Vitez cinema?
6 A. It's approximately 100 metres.
7 Q. And that appears on the map with a letter B; correct?
8 A. That is correct, sir, yes.
9 Q. Now I would like to turn your attention to the letter C
10 on that map. First of all, can you tell me what the
11 letter C represents?
12 A. The letter C represents the location of the veterinary
14 Q. What is the distance of the veterinary station from
15 General Blaskic's headquarters?
16 A. Approximately 900 metres.
17 Q. Now turning to the letter D that appears on that
18 exhibit, can you identify what that was?
19 A. Location of letter D is a building known as the
20 Dubrovica School.
21 Q. What was the Dubrovica School to your knowledge?
22 A. Again to my knowledge it was another location where not
23 only people from Muslims -- Bosnian Muslims from the
24 town of Vitez but also Bosnian Muslims from other
25 locations in other villages were also detained.
1 Q. What is the distance of the Dubrovica School from the
2 Hotel Vitez?
3 A. It's 2.6 kms.
4 Q. Now turning to the letter E on the map, what does that
6 A. The letter E represents the Vitez Chess Club.
7 Q. What is the distance of the Vitez Chess Club from
8 General Blaskic's headquarters?
9 A. The distance is 600 metres.
10 Q. Now turning to the letter F, what is the letter F on
11 that map?
12 A. The letter F is the PTT building.
13 Q. What is the distance of the PTT building from General
14 Blaskic's headquarters?
15 A. Approximately 75 metres.
16 Q. Now turning to the letter G on that map, what does the
17 letter G represent?
18 A. Letter G represents the location of where the front line
19 developed between Muslim forces in Stari Vitez and the
20 HVO units in Vitez town.
21 Q. On 16th April 19 96 -- 1993, I'm sorry?
22 A. Yes, as it developed on 16th April 1993.
23 Q. What is the distance from General Blaskic's headquarters
24 to the front line entry of Stari Vitez?
25 A. Approximately 300 metres.
1 Q. Now turning to the letter H, Mr. Leach, what does the
2 letter H represent?
3 A. The letter H represents the opposite side of the Muslim
4 enclave of Stari Vitez, which would be where the other
5 side of the confrontation line developed.
6 Q. How far away was that from General Blaskic's
8 A. That is 1.2 kms.
9 Q. Okay. Turning now to the letter I on that map, can you
10 identify what that represents?
11 JUDGE JORDA: Excuse me. I have a small question. If I
12 look at your circles, H is at 200 metres and, the fifth
13 circle is 1200 and Dubrovica School is at 2,060
14 metres. So what is the difference? Was it 1,000 or
15 1200 metres roughly?
16 A. The difference by the concentric circles again is the
17 line of sight distance but if you get in a car and drive
18 from the Hotel Vitez and follow the road, if I may show
19 you --
20 JUDGE JORDA: Yes, I see.
21 A. -- that then becomes 2.6 kms.
22 JUDGE JORDA: Thank you.
23 MR. HARMON: Please continue.
24 A. Yes. The letter I indicates the general location of
25 where the truck bomb, which exploded on the afternoon of
1 18th April, took place.
2 Q. All right. Now turning to the letter J, can you tell
3 us what that represents?
4 A. The letter J relates to a local factory premises, which
5 was converted by the British battalion of UNPROFOR into
6 a location they called the Echelon Garage. This was a
7 location where a sub-unit of mechanical engineers could
8 repair their vehicles and for refuelling purposes.
9 Q. What was the significance of that location?
10 A. As the conflict developed from 16th April through to
11 19th and 20th April 1993 a large number of Bosnian
12 Muslim civilians congregated on that building seeking
14 Q. Your Honour, I would now move this exhibit into
16 JUDGE JORDA: Very well.
17 MR. HARMON: Mr. Leach, I am now going to ask that there be
18 displayed a video tape. It's tape number 10. Can you
19 refer to your notes and inform the court what they will
20 see on video tape number 10?
21 A. As part of the mission when photographs of certain
22 locations were taken in May 1996 the IFOR forces
23 provided a helicopter for the Tribunal investigators,
24 for myself and one of the Dutch police photographers.
25 During a two and a half hour flight we flew around
1 various locations taking a video film to depict the
2 areas in the towns and villages. The clipping you'll
3 see at tape 10 will represent the area of Stari Vitez
4 and then the frame during the video presentation will
5 freeze and I will be able to indicate to you where the
6 Hotel Vitez is situated, to give you some idea of the
7 geographic and topography of the town.
8 Q. Will it also show, Mr. Leach, the Cerkez's headquarters
10 A. Yes, it will.
11 Q. If we could have the lights dimmed, we could then
12 proceed with tape 10.
13 Mr. Leach, if you just narrate as we proceed through this
14 tape. Can we have tape 10, please?
15 (Video tape played)
16 A. In the distance you will see the running track, which is
17 indicated on the town plan, and here you have the site
18 of the Vitez mass grave and the mosque in Stari Vitez.
19 You can see the destruction of buildings in the
20 foreground. We are now travelling down a road which
21 leads towards the Hotel Vitez and the site of the truck
22 bomb. The helicopter is almost over the Hotel Vitez a
23 few seconds ago, and what you are seeing is in the main
24 now the whole area of Stari Vitez. The area in the
25 centre picture now indicates where the bodies from the
1 deceased persons from the village of Ahmici were
2 buried. We have almost completed a full circle in the
3 air and you'll see some apartment buildings coming into
4 view. Where that is stopped there's a white strip at
5 the very top of the picture. That white strip is the
6 top of the Hotel Vitez.
7 MR. HARMON: Your Honour, I would ask that the film clip 10
8 be admitted into evidence.
9 (Video tape played)
10 MR. HARMON: There is more film?
11 A. This is another close-up of Stari Vitez. We pass over
12 the mosque and we are now just about to come over the
13 area where the front lines developed just now, at that
14 point, and you can see the apartment buildings in Vitez
15 town proper. The building that has just come into
16 view, and the frame should freeze, is the Hotel Vitez.
17 There you have in the main centre picture the Hotel
18 Vitez and in the bottom left-hand side of the picture is
19 the PTT building. The Cerkez headquarters would just
20 be out of sight at the top left corner of the picture.
21 The helicopter now traversed around the town and here we
22 have a view looking down through Vitez itself. The
23 building to the top left of the picture is the Vitez
24 school and shortly coming into the frame will be the
25 back of the Cinema building that you have seen in the
1 still photographs. That has just come into the frame
2 now. Again in the frame here you can see, top right
3 mid photograph is the Cerkez headquarters and the cinema
4 complex and to the far left is the rear of the Hotel
5 Vitez. So you can see the closeness of the two
7 The building in the centre ground now is the
8 municipal offices of Vitez, which again are opposite the
9 Hotel Vitez and the PTT building. That was a general
10 overview of the town of Vitez.
11 Q. Mr. Leach, I'm going to ask you to describe two films
12 that I'm now going to show to the Trial Chamber in
13 respect of Ahmici. Will you please -- they are tapes 5
14 and tapes 6. First of all, can you explain to the
15 court what they will see, but before you do that, would
16 you explain when those films were taken and under what
18 A. The films were taken again on the same helicopter flight
19 I described earlier, on Monday, 27th May 1996. I was
20 present in the helicopter with a Dutch photographer who
21 used the video camera. The two films you will see, the
22 first one is taken from the air, which will give you a
23 circumstance view or view on at least one occasion, and
24 maybe two, of the village of Ahmici, and during that
25 film I'll point out to you certain locations of the
1 second video will thereafter show you in close-up video
2 footage taken on the ground actually inside the village
4 Q. All right. Now if we could dim the lights, please --
5 JUDGE JORDA: Mr. Hayman.
6 MR. HAYMAN: Will these be marked as exhibits so the record
7 is clear?
8 JUDGE JORDA: Yes, I should think so, unless there are
9 objections, but in theory I do not see why they would be
10 -- wouldn't be put into the record.
11 MR. HAYMAN: They have not yet been. They have been marked
12 for identification as exhibits, so I would request that
13 that be done and also request that the witness'
14 description of the places depicted be limited to matters
15 within his personal knowledge and that he not describe
16 events to which he was not a witness.
17 JUDGE JORDA: Mr. Hayman, we have already had this
18 discussion. We had it yesterday. The Tribunal needs
19 to be informed about everything and in complete
20 detail. You will contest everything you like during
21 the cross-examination and now you are contesting these
22 films before even having seen them, but before we put
23 into question the presence or the lack of presence of
24 the witness' presence, everybody knows that this is a
25 prosecution witness. You are contesting films which
1 you have not even looked at. Please we will look at
2 the films. Probably they will be part of the
3 Prosecutor's evidence. We need to know all
4 information, and you can contest what you like, but we
5 do not have to go back to the conversation we had
6 yesterday having to do with good conduct intended to
7 move the trial forward properly, but please let's first
8 take a look at them.
9 MR. HARMON: Could we have the lights dimmed, please, and
10 then start with tape 5. Mr. Leach, if you would narrate
11 the film.
12 (Video tape played)
13 A. We now are over the village of Ahmici. The view you
14 can see now is taken from the main highway, so if you
15 were travelling down the main highway on the ground,
16 that is what you would see. We've now turned left from
17 the main highway. In the centre picture is a mosque
18 with a minaret destroyed. In centre picture now is a
19 grocery store and then the village road continues up the
20 hillside. One can see the destroyed houses. Having
21 travelled up the hillside to the top of the village,
22 this is the far most point of the village. All the
23 houses there are destroyed. The one with a roof has a
24 roof intact but it's not habitable. We have now
25 circled round the top of the village and are facing back
1 down the Lasva Valley towards Vitez and Travnik. So
2 the helicopter is now travelling back towards the main
3 highway between Vitez and Busovaca. This is a similar
4 shot depicting the damage in the village, travelling
5 from the uppermost part of the village.
6 We've now circled round. The building which has
7 now come into view is called the upper mosque. There
8 were two mosques, in the village of Ahmici. The one
9 you saw briefly earlier had a minaret; this one did not
10 have a minaret. This is approximately midway between
11 the main road and the furthest most point of the village
12 as you get to it at the top of the hill.
13 The helicopter pilot has merely circled round so
14 you get a view of all angles of that mosque. This is
15 the lower mosque in Ahmici, the one with the minaret.
16 This mosque is approximately 200 metres from the main
17 highway and is quite clearly visible as you travel up
18 and down the main highway, as is the majority of the
19 destruction that you have seen in the village, apart
20 from that in the upper part of the village at the very
22 That gives you a view from behind the mosque and
23 down the Ahmici road to the main highway. You can see
24 vehicles traversing the main highway travelling from
25 Vitez towards Zenica and Busovaca. That gives you a
1 view back down through the valley to Vitez town.
2 Q. Mr. Leach, have you been to Vitez -- to Ahmici, I'm
4 A. Yes, I have, yes.
5 Q. On how many occasions?
6 A. Many occasions.
7 Q. Now if we could keep the lights dimmed, we'll turn to
8 tape 6. Please explain what tape 6 is, Mr. Leach, as we
9 go along.
10 (Video tape played)
11 A. This is the video taken actually from the ground. It
12 was done in a variety of means, either standing on foot
13 and the photographer would simply traverse round to show
14 you a picture of what was present. In order to give an
15 indication and relate it to the aerial video, using a
16 compass at this point the photographer held position and
17 that is the general -- where he paused is the general
18 direction of the city of Zenica. This video is taken
19 right at the very top of the village. Busovaca would
20 be over the hill that you see there and the town of
21 Vitez would be behind the bushes that are now in the
22 foreground. Halfway into the village of Ahmici there
23 is a grocery store, which is still operating, and at
24 this point we placed the camera man on the bonnet of a
25 IFOR Landrover. He then sat on the Landrover and as we
1 drove from the centre of the village to the top of the
2 village, he then took video footage. Hence it's a
3 little bit bumpy. We didn't have too much technical
4 equipment to support us. The building that first came
5 into view at that section was the upper mosque, and we
6 are now travelling from the centre of the village
7 towards the upper mosque and getting closer to it.
8 Here you have a close-up on the ground picture of the
9 upper mosque in Ahmici.
10 Q. The distance from Ahmici to the Hotel Vitez where
11 General Blaskic's headquarters were located was how far?
12 A. It's 4.8 kms. We've now reached the end of the
13 passable roadway. It's possible to walk down on foot
14 further. You can just see the tracks and some houses
15 beyond, where there's a divergence in the fork. You
16 then continue to the right.
17 We're now approaching the very edge of the village
18 at the highest point and that is as far as we could
19 travel. You are able to travel a few hundred metres on
20 foot but we were not allowed to travel because of the
21 possibility of mines.
22 Q. What are these buildings, Mr. Leach?
23 A. These are the former buildings of residents from the
24 village of Ahmici. We've now started again at the top
25 of the village and have started to drive back down
1 towards the centre. In effect we have just turned
2 round. The reason to do this was just it was
3 impossible to take an accurate video doing it in just
4 one direction.
5 Q. Now are these destroyed Croat homes or destroyed Muslim
7 A. As far as I'm aware they are all Muslim homes.
8 Q. When was the last time you were in Vitez -- sorry --
9 when was the last time you were in Ahmici?
10 A. Last week.
11 Q. Are there any Muslims living in Ahmici today?
12 A. Not to my knowledge, no. That view you can see there
13 is from the upper part of Ahmici. You would have a
14 view down on to the village of Nadioci. The main
15 Busovaca, Vitez, Zenica highway would go through the
16 land that's in the far distance in the valley itself.
17 Again that's the upper mosque in Ahmici. I should say,
18 your Honours, that the vehicle is travelling, as you can
19 see, quite slowly, 3, 4, 5 miles an hour.
20 Q. What is depicted in the image right there?
21 A. That is a house which I believe is still occupied by
22 former Bosnian Croat residents of the village. I
23 hadn't spoken to anybody in that home to confirm that.
24 The point where the video is taken from the Landrover
25 from the centre of the village going up, we are now in
1 the same position but now travelling from the centre of
2 the village where the grocery store is and down towards
3 the main highway. The main highway from this point is
4 some 300-400 metres. Coming into the centre of the
5 picture just on the left there is the mosque which had a
6 minaret which was destroyed.
7 To the left there you can see a junction.
8 There's a substantial portion of the village to the
9 left, which you have seen from the aerial shot, but we
10 were unable to go down that with a vehicle at this
11 time. Having left the mosque behind us, we're now
12 approaching the main highway: the main highway is there
14 Q. That's the road between Vitez and Busovaca; is that
16 A. Yes, you could travel to Busovaca from Vitez.
17 Q. Is this the view from the highway looking back into the
18 village of Ahmici?
19 A. Yes, it is. Now travelling forward back into the
20 village and you can see the mosque coming into view.
21 That is the school building in Ahmici. Having left the
22 mosque behind us, we're now travelling back to the
23 centre of the village where the grocery store is
25 Q. Again there appear to be some houses intact there,
1 Mr. Leach. Can you explain that?
2 A. Again it's my information that the intact houses that
3 you see are Bosnian Croat residents of the village and
4 that they were not damaged during the conflict on the
5 morning of 16th April. That is the grocery store that
6 I was mentioning. We travel up a narrow track to a
7 series of intact houses, which are left of centre of the
8 village on the hillside.
9 Q. Your Honours, I would ask that tape number 5 and tape
10 number 6 be admitted into evidence.
11 JUDGE JORDA: Yes, Mr. Hayman?
12 MR. HAYMAN: No objection. Is that to be their exhibit
13 number, known as tape 5?
14 MR. HARMON: No, I wait until the Registrar gives me a
15 number and then he will indicate what they are.
16 JUDGE JORDA: Mr. Dubuisson, will a copy of these be given
17 to the Defence? Will there be duplicates made of cuts?
18 MR. HARMON: There can be. There's no problem.
19 JUDGE JORDA: Either given to the Defence as all the maps
20 were or put into the record and made available to the
21 Defence so the Defence may ask any questions it wants
22 to, even if it has to re-show these pictures during the
23 cross-examination either at the request of Mr. Hayman or
24 Mr. Nobilo.
25 I think now that we have finished this sequence,
1 unless you have another question concerning the film,
2 this might be a good point to stop, unless you have
3 another question you would like to ask in order to end
4 these two exhibits which were filed.
5 MR. HARMON: No. It is a good time to stop, your Honour.
6 JUDGE JORDA: Very well. We will suspend the hearing. I
7 remind you that we will meet on Monday, Tuesday,
8 Wednesday, Thursday from 10.00-1.00 and I ask the
9 Prosecutor that there be no interruption of the
10 witnesses even if a witness has to come back at a later
11 time to finish his testimony and to be subjected to
12 cross-examination by the Defence. I'm sure I can count
13 on you to do this, Mr. Prosecutor. We are now
14 suspending the hearing. The hearing will start again
15 at 10 o'clock on Monday.
16 (12.55 pm)
17 (Hearing adjourned until 10.00 on Monday morning)