1 Tuesday, 28 October 2008
2 [Status Conference]
3 [Open session]
4 [The accused entered court]
5 --- Upon commencing at 8.59 a.m.
6 THE REGISTRAR: This is the case IT-95-5/18-PT, The Prosecutor
7 versus Radovan Karadzic.
8 JUDGE BONOMY: Good morning, Mr. Karadzic. I note that you
9 appear again without counsel. Can you please confirm to me that you
10 continue to represent yourself.
11 THE ACCUSED: [Microphone not activated]
12 THE INTERPRETER: Microphone, please.
13 JUDGE BONOMY: Thank you.
14 This Status Conference was arranged when the process of
15 presenting a motion to amend the indictment was likely to be completed.
16 The motion was filed on the 22nd of September.
17 I understand that you received the translation yesterday, the
18 27th of October, and it's at that stage that the Court becomes seized of
19 the matter. I wish to, first of all, clarify certain things from the
20 Prosecution point of view before I turn to you for any comments you wish
21 to make on the state of play now that that motion is translated into your
23 Mr. Tieger, can you explain to me what supporting material for
24 the motion and the proposed amended indictment, if any, remains unserved
25 or unintimated to the accused.
1 MR. TIEGER: Your Honour, as a general matter, the answer is
2 none. I understand, however, there may be a few, that is, a handful of
3 translation, that have not been provided; and there may also be an issue
4 with some of the B/C/S audios that I would need to check often. My
5 understanding previously was that all disclosure had a been provided. I
6 will attend to that immediately.
7 JUDGE BONOMY: B/C/S audios are material in his language. If
8 they have been disclosed in that form, then they've been disclosed in
9 terms of the Rules. I'm more concerned about documents you say are
10 untranslated. Can you clarify the position in regard to them.
11 MR. TIEGER: If the Court will give me just a moment, Your
13 The best clarification I can provide at this point is that there
14 are no more than four or five, as I understand it; and I will check
15 immediately on the status of those translations and make them a priority,
17 JUDGE BONOMY: Do you know whether these are lengthy documents or
18 simple documents?
19 MR. TIEGER: I do not, at this time, Your Honour.
20 JUDGE BONOMY: Rather an unsatisfactory state of affairs,
21 Mr. Tieger, at this stage, I have to say. That is the sort of simple
22 information that this Trial Chamber is entitled to have before it
23 whenever it comes into court. I am about to adjourn to enable you to
24 check the position, and we'll resume when you're able to tell the clerk
25 that that has been done.
1 --- Break taken at 9.04 a.m.
2 --- On resuming at 9.10 a.m.
3 JUDGE BONOMY: I gather you have the answer, Mr. Tieger.
4 MR. TIEGER: Yes, Your Honour.
5 Four documents, comprising a total of 60 pages, and those can be
6 provided, I'm told, by Thursday and -- well, Thursday is what I was told
7 so I would say by Friday.
8 JUDGE BONOMY: Of this week?
9 MR. TIEGER: Yes.
10 JUDGE BONOMY: All right. Thank you.
11 Now, Mr. Karadzic, you've got the motion; you've got the proposed
12 indictment. By the end of this week, you will have all the supporting
13 material, which is the basis for the indictment, according to the
14 Prosecution. The next issue is the time for you to respond to this
15 motion, and the normal period to response for a motion of this kind is
16 14 days.
17 Now, do you have anything to say on that issue?
18 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] Not for the moment. I don't have
19 anything to say on that issue, but I must say that I'm not prepared for
20 this Status Conference. Yesterday, towards the evening, I received
21 official information or instructions that this Status Conference would be
22 held; and in the media, I heard it on Friday the 24th, and then I
23 submitted a motion on that subject.
24 I also received the indictment yesterday; and, all in all, I have
25 not had time to even look at it because I had a visit and another matters
1 to attend to, so that have I nothing to offer up for today's Status
2 Conference, because, quite simply, I'm not prepared for this conference.
3 I had a lot of work to do, I still do not have a team, and so on and so
5 JUDGE BONOMY: Well, I take some responsibility for the situation
6 that led to you receiving formal notification, as you put it, in B/C/S of
7 today's hearing only yesterday; however, I do know that you were aware of
8 the hearing last week and that you did, in fact, make a submission on
9 Friday about it. You're also aware that I tried to take account of other
10 issues that face you at the moment; but, at the same time, this case has
11 to proceed and I'm trying to make an orderly arrangement for the progress
12 this case, taking into account the other commitments that you are faced
13 with at the moment, which are beyond your control, as I understand.
14 I'm giving you the opportunity, now that you are here, to
15 consider what you believe to be a reasonable period to respond. In the
16 absence of a motion, then responses will be due in 14 days, and the Trial
17 Chamber will proceed to deal with the motion for amendment on that basis.
18 If you want to leave it that way, that's a matter for you, and we
19 can adjourn.
20 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] I do believe that, even for that
21 response, I would have to seek counsel from my legal advisors, I just
22 have just one so far, and I hope that quite soon I will be able to set up
23 my team and will be prepared for Status Conference.
24 As far as speed of work is concerned, I think that in the 120
25 days that usually elapse, there is usually one Status Conference held
1 that at that period of time; whereas, so far we have four.
2 JUDGE BONOMY: So is that all you wish to say?
3 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] I wasn't even ready to say that
4 today. I quite simply stated that I'm not prepared for today's Status
6 JUDGE BONOMY: Well, as matters stand, then, from the moment that
7 you receive in B/C/S the supporting material for the motion to amend the
8 indictment, you will have 14 days to respond to that.
9 The only other matter that I have in mind to deal with is fixing
10 the next Status Conference.
11 Now, Mr. Tieger, before I do that, do you have any other matter
12 to raise?
13 MR. TIEGER: No, Your Honour. Thank you.
14 JUDGE BONOMY: There is one motion, I note, that certainly passed
15 through my hands yesterday which is for judicial notice of adjudicated
16 facts. I assume that in the same way as you consented to postponement of
17 the motions, the preliminary motions, when the accused sought that a
18 decision that he need not respond until the question of the indictment
19 had been resolved, that would also be your position in relation to the
20 motion for judicial notice of adjudicated facts.
21 MR. TIEGER: That's fine, Your Honour, yes.
22 JUDGE BONOMY: So there are these two issues, Mr. Karadzic. You
23 requested that you need not submit preliminary motions until after the
24 whole issue of indictment was resolved and the Trial Chamber agreed to
25 that. The same is the position in relation to the motion which has just
1 submitted, you may not have received it, which is for judicial notice of
2 adjudicated facts. You can take it that the Trial Chamber will not
3 address that issue until the whole issue of the indictment has been
5 Now, is there any other matter that you wish to raise before I
6 fix the date for the next Status Conference?
7 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] I want to say that I've already
8 traversed a certain path without my Defence team. I have gone a certain
9 way towards my Defence, but I will have -- be facing problems. I don't
10 have the necessary resources, I don't have a Defence team, and with the
11 speed at which matters are progressing in these proceedings, I am afraid
12 that I will be in an even less equal position, and I'd like to you be
13 aware of that.
14 JUDGE BONOMY: I'm astonished at your reference to speed. I'm
15 extremely disappointed at the very slow rate at which this case is
16 proceeding. You were in custody from, at the latest, the 21st of July.
17 I think you suggest it was even earlier than that, and you were here on
18 the 30th of July. We're only now at the stage of considering a motion to
19 amend the indictment which the Prosecution hope will be the indictment on
20 which the trial progresses.
21 That's a period of three months, and we've gone virtually
22 nowhere. Rest assured, that is not a fast rate of speed for any court to
23 progress. It's your own choice, as you know very well, that you
24 represent yourself, and I'm afraid that carries particular problems which
25 you've been told about repeatedly. You're willing to take on your own
1 shoulders, and that is a matter for you at this stage.
2 So, in these circumstances, we will adjourn now and the next
3 Status Conference is likely to be - there will be a written order
4 confirming it, but you can put it in your diary - it is likely to be on
5 Tuesday, the 20th of January.
6 --- Whereupon the Status Conference adjourned
7 at 9.19 a.m.