1 Monday, 21 June 2004
2 [Open session]
3 [The accused entered court]
4 --- Upon commencing at 9.07 a.m.
5 JUDGE ORIE: Good morning to everyone. Madam Registrar, would you
6 please call the case.
7 THE REGISTRAR: Case Number IT-00-39-T, The Prosecutor versus
8 Momcilo Krajisnik.
9 JUDGE ORIE: Thank you, Madam Registrar.
10 Mr. Stewart, I'm informed that the Defence would like to address
11 the Chamber. I take it it is in respect of scheduling. We briefly dealt
12 with the issue in closed session last week, but as I indicated at that
13 time, it's a matter that should be discussed, or at least explained, in
14 open court.
15 Let me just repeat what I said in closed session last week: That
16 the parties have submitted to the Chamber a, let's say, a programme of
17 communications which might lead to considerable savings in court time.
18 The parties would communicate about the facts that took place mainly in
19 the municipalities and at the same time they would discuss to what extent
20 expert reports would be acceptable for the Defence or not and what were
21 the issues still to be dealt with during court hearings.
22 The schedule proposed would at least include not sitting after
23 this week until the summer recess, and in order to continue it would also
24 have consequences for time we would sit in the month of September because
25 not the whole of the programme could be concluded before the summer
1 recess. The Chamber, as I indicated last week, will follow the
2 suggestions of the parties, that is, not to sit in the month of July, but,
3 and I added that as one of the conditions or one of the -- one of the
4 things the Chamber wants to do is to keep a close eye on the progress made
5 during these communications, during these discussions between the parties,
6 because if we finally would spend a couple of weeks on that just at the
7 end to find out that there was not a substantial agreement on some of
8 these facts, we could have used our time better in court to hear the
9 witnesses so that the Chamber would be in a position to form its opinion
10 on the basis of testimony rather than on the basis of agreement between
11 the parties.
12 And I think I indicated that we would like to have our first
13 monitoring moment after the first two weeks of the communications between
14 the parties - that would be approximately the 9th of July - so that we
15 could decide whether we would continue on this path or whether we should
16 go back to hearing witnesses in court. That's what I said.
17 I also said that we would have to discuss this in more detail
18 during open sessions. The Chamber is of the opinion that the public is
19 entitled to know more in detail how the Chamber considers these matters;
20 that is, how much time did we use in court until now, how much time has
21 the Prosecution taken for its case presentation until now, what are the
22 prospects for the near future if we would go the one way or the other way.
23 I'm preparing that to -- well, to further explain what is behind this new
24 proposed schedule. That's what I referred to already last week in closed
25 session and I said what we have to do in open court.
1 I haven't prepared fully yet all the details, the -- well, the
2 statistical data. I'm also looking back at what happened in the last
3 month of 2003 when we discussed the start of the case. I take it that
4 within one or two days I would be ready to fully explain with all the data
5 available. If there's anything apart from that you'd like to raise at
6 this moment, please do so.
7 MR. STEWART: Yes, thank you for that, Your Honour. In fact, that
8 wasn't -- I understood that Your Honour would probably deal with this more
9 fully in a day or so's time, and I wasn't proposing to take time on that
10 issue, but I'm grateful for the indications given. And my simple comment
11 on that this morning is the Defence does strongly favour these matters
12 being fully and openly discussed in open court. We heartily endorse the
13 Trial Chamber's observations that the public at large, whatever section of
14 the public, do have the right to know exactly what is going on and the
15 reasons, and we're grateful that it will be fully discussed and ventilated
16 in open court.
17 So I say no more this morning because clearly that opportunity
18 will arise. Your Honour, rather a more specific immediate point of
19 scheduling: Your Honour, we have found that the scheduling for this week
20 involves sitting every morning. Your Honour, may we say that it isn't all
21 that easy for anybody involved, the Trial Chamber, of course, we
22 recognise, and anybody else, the scheduling. But we had understood until
23 -- in fact, until yesterday -- I'm not quite sure when everything was
24 available to be checked on the internet, but we had understood that we
25 would be sitting in the afternoon on Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday this
1 week. That was what was scheduled, and that was what appeared on the
2 printed schedule which we have had in our possession for a long time.
3 When we checked the internet yesterday, we found that we were in the
4 morning, so I don't know exactly when in the course of last week or
5 whenever the change became publicly available. But we were otherwise,
6 apart from any opportunity we had to check it through those channels, we
7 were certainly not notified or consulted of any -- in relation to any such
9 Your Honour, often that's no more than a very minor inconvenience,
10 and it's not a huge inconvenience at the moment, but I would like to say
11 that I have myself made some arrangements this week which depended upon,
12 particularly on Wednesday, on the hearing being on Wednesday afternoon.
13 And Your Honour knows from Your Honour's own previous practical experience
14 that such troublesome matters for all concerned as organising with the
15 Registry, travel arrangements and so on, are time consuming and difficult,
16 and they can't always be left until the last minute. So Your Honour -- I
17 want to be actually very open about what is it is, Your Honour. Since we
18 are in open court and we adhere to the principle of publicity, I'll be
19 absolutely frank what it is. I am very pleased to say that my chambers in
20 London are short listed as six chambers for an award of Chambers of the
21 Year for this year, and since I've been absent nearly all the time over
22 the last few months, they have been very keen that I, as one of the
23 Queen's Counsel in those chambers, should attend on Tuesday evening, and I
24 am very keen to go there. It is very difficult to do if I have to be back
25 on Wednesday morning, first thing, to be in court here at 9.00.
1 JUDGE ORIE: Let's see whether we could change for Wednesday. I
2 mean, being Chambers of the Year, of course, is not something you
3 should --
4 MR. STEWART: Easily underestimated --
5 JUDGE ORIE: No, no, no, but at least there's a fair chance. It's
6 like in the European championships, you never know what the outcome will
8 I'll take care that whenever possible, and I think at this moment
9 the court schedule of the Tribunal might be such that there's some
10 flexibility possible.
11 MR. STEWART: Your Honour, I would clearly like to add, in the
12 spirit of helpfulness, that if I know what is coming up on Wednesday
13 morning, I wouldn't even, in the circumstances, need necessarily to ask
14 the Trial Chamber to make that adjustment; I would just need to know what
15 was going to happen on Wednesday morning so that it didn't cause trouble
16 for the Trial Chamber and everybody else if I were not here until the
17 middle of the morning.
18 JUDGE ORIE: We will see what we can do to accommodate you. Of
19 course, we also have to look at witnesses, we have to look at staff, we
20 have to ask the Prosecution, but we'll do that in between -- Prosecution's
21 now aware of the problem. Prosecution is also presenting the witnesses.
22 So I saw, Mr. Harmon, that you are also a bit impressed by the nomination.
23 MR. STEWART: That was the idea, I wanted to impress Mr. Harmon,
24 Your Honour. That was the main purpose of my intervention.
25 MR. HARMON: Good morning, Your Honours, Counsel. We, of course,
1 are willing to accommodate counsel in this respect.
2 JUDGE ORIE: So whenever possible, we will accommodate you and we
3 will try to get you certainty as soon as possible, I hope even this
5 MR. STEWART: Yes, Your Honour. And our sympathies to two-thirds
6 of the Bench for the championships mentioned a moment ago.
7 JUDGE ORIE: Thank you very much, Mr. Stewart.
8 Then, is the Prosecution ready to resume the examination-in-chief
9 of Witness 628 --
10 MR. HARMON: We are, Your Honour.
11 JUDGE ORIE: -- in closed session? Then I'd like to ask the
12 usher to pull the curtains down, and we'll turn into closed session.
13 [Closed session]
12 Pages 4012 to 4093 redacted, closed session
17 --- Whereupon the hearing adjourned at 1.45 p.m.,
18 to be reconvened on Tuesday, the 22nd day of June,
19 2004, at 9.00 a.m.