1 Tuesday, 21 May, 2002
2 [Open session]
3 [Initial Appearance]
4 [The accused entered court]
5 --- Upon commencing at 2.19 p.m.
6 JUDGE LIU: Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. Madam
7 Registrar, would you please call the case?
8 THE REGISTRAR: Good afternoon, Your Honour. This is case number
9 IT-95-11-I, the Prosecutor versus Milan Martic.
10 JUDGE LIU: Thank you. May I have the appearances, please. For
11 the Prosecution?
12 MS. UERTZ-RETZLAFF: Good afternoon, Your Honour. For the
13 Prosecution Ms. Diane Boles as case manager and my name is Hildegard
15 JUDGE LIU: Thank you. For the accused?
16 MR. S. KASTRATOVIC: [Interpretation] Your Honours, my learned
17 friends, legal assistants, ladies and gentlemen, journalists, this is my
18 first appearance before the International Criminal Tribunal here in The
19 Hague and therefore, I am bound to introduce myself to you, and I will do
20 that with pleasure. I'm Strahina Kastratovic from -- lawyer from
21 Belgrade, I'm afraid you will be in trouble pronouncing my name, but I
22 suppose you will learn that. I will be the lead counsellor in the
23 defence of the accused, Milan Martic. My legal assistant will be Marko
24 Kastratovic. This is the young man sitting to my left.
25 I will not give you the year of my birth, and deliberately so. I
1 hope you will understand that and understand it [As interpreted]. I have
2 been a lawyer for almost 40 years and no doubt, thus you will be also able
3 to establish what I've tried to gloss over. I also wish to say something
4 which I believe is very important and which I think will affect our future
5 work. My --
6 JUDGE LIU: Well, Mr. Kastratovic. I hope what you said is
7 closely related to this initial appearance. I will give you a chance if
8 you have something to talk about, the substantial matters for the initial
9 appearance. Here, we just want to know your name and your co-counsel's
11 MR. S. KASTRATOVIC: [Interpretation] May I just say that I have
12 problems hearing. It seems that my headset is not quite all right and I
13 can't hear very well.
14 JUDGE LIU: Is that okay? You can hear me?
15 MR. S. KASTRATOVIC: [Interpretation] Yes, yes, I can. But, Your
16 Honour, could you repeat, please, what you just said? Because I could not
17 hear you.
18 JUDGE LIU: Well, just now I was telling you that I hope what you
19 said is closely related to this initial appearance. I'll give you a
20 chance if you have something to talk about. That is the substantial
21 matters for the initial appearance. Here, at this moment, we just want to
22 know your name and your co-counsel's name.
23 MR. S. KASTRATOVIC: [Interpretation] Thank you, Your Honour, for
24 this instruction. I hope you will give me an opportunity to make some
25 comments later on. I believe they will be of major importance for our
1 cooperation with our learned friends and the honourable court precisely
2 because I think there are certain matters which we shall be able to
3 resolve easier if I point out them at -- right at the outset. Thank you
4 very much. I have given you my name and some information about myself.
5 JUDGE LIU: Yes. There is one question I want to ask you. Are
6 you the counsel for the accused just for this initial appearance or for
7 the whole trial proceedings?
8 MR. S. KASTRATOVIC: [Interpretation] I am Mr. Milan Martic's
9 counsel. I have been his counsel from the beginning, and I hope that, if
10 my health serves me well, I will be with him until the end, with the team
11 that I will appoint and which I have already appointed, to a degree.
12 JUDGE LIU: Thank you very much. You may sit down, please. We
13 will proceed with the initial appearance of the accused. Mr. Martic,
14 pursuant to Rule 62 of the Rules of Procedure and Evidence.
15 Mr. Martic, would you please stand up? Can you hear the
16 proceedings in a language that you understand?
17 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] -- [no interpretation].
18 THE INTERPRETER: Could the microphone for the accused be switched
20 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] Yes, I can understand everything.
21 JUDGE LIU: Would you please give your full name and the nicknames
22 for the record?
23 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] I am Milan Martic. I have no
25 JUDGE LIU: Very well. What is the date and place of your birth?
1 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] I was born on the 18th of November,
2 1954, in the village of Zagrebvici, municipality of Knin.
3 JUDGE LIU: What is the address at which you resided before you
4 were arrested?
5 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] My address was in Serbia, Vrnjacka
6 Banja, Slatinski 11B.
7 JUDGE LIU: Thank you. Have you received the indictment against
8 you in a language you understand? And did you have a chance to read it?
9 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] Yes. I received it some 15 days
10 ago, but I also saw it before that. That is, I have had the opportunity
11 to read it and understand it.
12 JUDGE LIU: Do you understand its contents?
13 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] Yes, I do, fully.
14 JUDGE LIU: Do you have an opportunity to discuss the indictment
15 with your counsel?
16 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] As much as I communicated with him
17 before I surrendered myself to the Tribunal.
18 JUDGE LIU: Have you been advised of your rights under the Statute
19 and Rules of Procedure and Evidence of this Tribunal?
20 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] Yes, some.
21 JUDGE LIU: Thank you. You may sit down, please.
22 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] Thank you.
23 JUDGE LIU: Any way, I will let Madam Registrar to read out
24 Article 20 and 21 of the Statute, which is about the rights of the
1 THE REGISTRAR: Yes, Your Honour. Article 20: Commencement and
2 conduct of trial proceedings. The Trial Chamber shall ensure that a trial
3 is fair and expeditious and that the proceedings are conducted in
4 accordance with the Rules of Procedure and Evidence, with full respect for
5 the rights of the accused and due regard for the protection of victims and
7 2: A person against whom an indictment has been confirmed shall,
8 pursuant to an order or an arrest warrant of the International Tribunal,
9 be taken into custody, immediately informed of the charges against him and
10 transferred to the International Tribunal.
11 3: The Trial Chamber shall read the indictment, satisfy itself
12 that the rights of the accused are respected, confirm that the accused
13 understands the indictment and instruct the accused to enter a plea. The
14 Trial Chamber shall then set a date for trial.
15 4: The hearing shall be public unless the Trial Chamber decides
16 to close the proceedings in accordance with its Rules of Procedure and
18 Article 21, rights of the accused.
19 1: All persons shall be equal before the International Tribunal.
20 2: In the determination of charges against him, the accused shall
21 be entitled to a fair and public hearing, subject to Article 22 of the
23 3: The accused shall be presumed innocent until proven guilty
24 according to the provisions of the present Statute.
25 4: In the determination of any charges against the accused
1 pursuant to the present statute, the accused shall be entitled to the
2 following minimum guarantees in full equality.
3 A: To be informed promptly and in detail, in a language which I
4 understands, of the nature and cause of the charge against him.
5 B: To have adequate time and facilities for the preparation of
6 his defence and to communicate with counsel of his own choosing.
7 C: To be tried without undue delay.
8 D: To be tried in his presence and to defend himself in person or
9 through legal assistance of his own choosing, to be informed, if he does
10 not have legal assistance of this right. And to have legal assistance
11 assigned to him, in any case where the interests of justice so require,
12 and without payment by him in any such case, if he does not have
13 sufficient means to pay for it.
14 E: To examine or have examined the witnesses against him and to
15 obtain the attendance and examination of witnesses on his behalf under the
16 same conditions as witnesses against him.
17 F: To have the free assistance of an interpreter if he can not
18 understand or speak the language used in the International Tribunal.
19 G: Not to be compelled to testify against himself or confess
21 JUDGE LIU: Madam Registrar, would you please read out the
23 THE REGISTRAR: Yes, Your Honour, the Prosecutor of the Tribunal
24 against Milan Martic. The Prosecutor of the International Criminal
25 Tribunal for the Former Yugoslavia, pursuant to his authority under
1 Article 18 of the statute of the International Criminal Tribunal for the
2 Former Yugoslavia, Tribunal Statute, charges:
3 1: Since the summer of 1991, the Armed Forces of the Republic of
4 Croatia, HV, have been engaged in an armed conflict with the armed forces
5 of the self-proclaimed Republic of Serbian Krajina, ARSK. From the
6 commencements of the war in the summer of 1991, until the end of the year,
7 the ARSK, with the assistance of the Yugoslav People's Army, also known as
8 the JNA, defeated the HV in numerous battles taking control of
9 approximately one-third of the Republic of Croatia, including parts of
10 East and West Slovenia and the Krajina. After the ceasefire in January of
11 1992, the United Nations Protection Force, UNPROFOR, was installed in the
12 areas held by the ARSK.
13 One area held by the ARSK in Western Slovenia was the UN Western
14 Zone, also known as Sector West, which remained under the control of the
15 ARSK until the 1st of May, 1995.
16 On 1 May, 1995, the HV attacked the ARSK forces in Sector West and
17 drove the ARSK forces south across the Sava River into the Serbian held
18 part of Bosnia.
19 In retaliation the military forces of the ARSK were given orders
20 by Milan Martic, the president of the self-proclaimed Republic of Serbian
21 Krajina, RSK, to attack three Croatian cities, including Zagreb, the
22 capital of the Republic of Croatia.
23 The Orkan rocket, a long range weapon, can be fitted with
24 different warheads to accomplish distinct tasks: either to destroy
25 military targets or to kill people. When the Orkan is fitted with
12 Blank page inserted to ensure pagination corresponds between the French and
13 English transcripts.
1 a "cluster bomb" such as used against Zagreb, it is an anti-personnel
2 weapon designed only to kill people.
3 On the 2nd of May, 1995, at approximately 10.25 hours, upon the
4 orders of Milan Martic, Orkan rockets fitted with "cluster bomb" warheads
5 were fired into the central part of Zagreb by the ARSK, causing death and
6 injury to civilians in Zagreb. This was an unlawful attack against a
7 civilian population and individual citizens.
8 On May 3, 1995, at approximately 12.10 hours, upon the order of
9 Milan Martic, the ARSK fired additional Orkan rockets with "cluster bomb"
10 warheads into the central part of Zagreb, again causing death and injury
11 to civilians in Zagreb. This was also an unlawful attack against the
12 civilian population and individual citizens.
13 The accused, Milan Martic, was born on the 18th of November, 1945,
14 near Knin --
15 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] 54, don't make me older than I am.
16 I was born in 1954.
17 THE REGISTRAR: I stand corrected by the accused.
18 Milan Martic was born on the 18th of November, 1954, near Knin
19 Croatia. He is a graduate of the Croatian police academy and was a senior
20 inspector with the Croatian Ministry of Internal Affairs.
21 In January of 1991, Milan Martic was named head of internal
22 affairs for the self-proclaimed RSK. He was reappointed to that post in
23 1993, and in February of 1994, he became president of the self-proclaimed
24 RSK. He currently resides in Knin, the capital of the self-proclaimed
1 General allegations:
2 At all relevant times, a state of armed conflict existed in the
3 Republic of Croatia.
4 At all relevant times, the victims alleged in this indictment were
5 civilians who were protected by the laws and customs of war.
6 At all relevant times, Milan Martic was required to abide by the
7 laws and customs governing the conduct of war.
9 Count 1: On the 2nd of May, 1995, Milan Martic, as president of
10 the self-proclaimed RSK, knowingly and willingly ordered an unlawful
11 attack against the civilian population and individual civilians of Zagreb,
12 causing at least five deaths and numerous injuries to the civilian
13 population and individual civilians of Zagreb, and in doing so, Milan
14 Martic violated the laws and customs governing the conduct of war, a crime
15 recognised by Articles 3 and 7(1) of the Tribunal statute; or
16 alternatively, count 2:
17 On May 2, 1995, Milan Martic, as president of the self-proclaimed
18 RSK, knew or had reason to know, that a subordinate in the ARSK was about
19 to commit and did commit a war crime, that is the unlawful rocket attack
20 against the civilian population and individual civilians of Zagreb, and
21 Milan Martic failed to take the necessary and reasonable measures to
22 prevent the attack and failed to punish the perpetrators of the attack,
23 all in violation of Articles 3 and 7(3) of the Tribunal Statute.
24 Count 3:
25 On 3 May, 1995, Milan Martic, as president of the self-proclaimed
1 RSK, knowingly and willingly -- wilfully, excuse me, ordered an unlawful
2 attack against a civilian population and individual civilians of Zagreb,
3 causing at least two deaths and numerous injuries to the civilian
4 population and individual civilians of Zagreb, and in doing so, Milan
5 Martic violated the laws and customs governing the conduct of war, a crime
6 recognised by Articles 3 and 7(1) of the Tribunal statute; or,
7 alternatively, count 4:
8 On 3 May, 1995, Milan Martic, as president of the self-proclaimed
9 RSK, knew or had reason to know that a subordinate in the ARSK was about
10 to commit and did commit a war crime, that is, the unlawful rocket attack
11 against the civilian population and individual civilians of Zagreb, and
12 Milan Martic failed to take the necessary and reasonable measures to
13 prevent the attack and failed to punish the perpetrators of the attack,
14 all in violation of Articles 3 and 7(3) of the Tribunal Statute.
15 JUDGE LIU: Thank you, Madam Registrar. In accordance with the
16 Rule 62 of the Rules of Procedure and Evidence of this Tribunal, the
17 accused has the right to plead guilty or not guilty to each of the counts
18 today or within 30 days from this initial appearance. Shall the accused
19 fail to enter a plea within this time limit, the Trial Chamber shall enter
20 a plea of not guilty on his behalf.
21 Mr. Kastratovic, is your client ready to enter his plea today?
22 MR. S. KASTRATOVIC: [Interpretation] Yes, he is, but using a
23 general sentence guilty or not guilty, not going into reasons for either.
24 So the client will answer your question.
25 JUDGE LIU: Yes. Mr. Martic, I will now repeat the individual
1 charges brought against you, and then I will ask you whether you plead
2 guilty or not guilty to the specific charge. Your answer in each case
3 should be guilty or not guilty as the case may be. Do you understand
5 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] I do.
6 JUDGE LIU: Very well. Let's begin. Count 1 contains a charge of
7 an unlawful attack on the civilians on May 2nd, 1995, as a violation of
8 the law or customs of law that you alleged ordered. How do you plead?
9 Guilty or not guilty?
10 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] Not guilty.
11 JUDGE LIU: Count 2 charges you alternatively, with commanding
12 responsibility for unlawful attack on civilians on May 2nd, 1995, as a
13 violation of the laws and customs of war. Do you plead guilty or not
15 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] Not guilty.
16 JUDGE LIU: Count 3 contains a charge of unlawful attack on
17 civilians on May the 3rd, 1995, as a violations of the laws or customs of
18 war, that you allegedly ordered. How do you plead, guilty or not guilty?
19 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] Not guilty, and my counsel will
20 provide further explanation why did I do what I did.
21 JUDGE LIU: Count 4 charges you alternatively with command
22 responsibility of unlawful attack on civilians on May the 3rd, 1995, as
23 a violation of the laws or customs of war. How do you plead, guilty or
24 not guilty?
25 THE ACCUSED: [Interpretation] Not guilty.
1 JUDGE LIU: Thank you, sir. You may sit down, please.
2 May Madam Registrar take note that Mr. Martic pleaded not guilty
3 to the counts of the indictment.
4 The Registrar will be instructed to fix a date for trial when
5 appropriate. The accused is to remain in custody until further order.
6 Is there any other matter the Prosecution wishes to raise at this
7 stage? Yes, Madam Prosecutor?
8 MS. UERTZ-RETZLAFF: Yes, Your Honour. It's actually two points
9 that I want to raise. The first is actually an information for Your
10 Honour, in relation to disclosure, today we have already provided the
11 supporting material in English and also the transcript of the Rule 61
12 hearing in this case, including also the documentary evidence that was
13 provided. This is the first point.
14 JUDGE LIU: Are they all translated into B/C/S or into any other
15 language that the accused understands?
16 MS. UERTZ-RETZLAFF: It was provided in English language and the
17 translation will be provided within the time limits given by the Rules.
18 JUDGE LIU: Thank you.
19 MS. UERTZ-RETZLAFF: And the second point is just already for the
20 Defence and for the Trial Chamber. The Prosecution intends to amend the
21 indictment, and not only in relation to the wrong birth date, but also in
22 relation to substantial matters.
23 JUDGE LIU: Well, for your information, the Presiding Judge of
24 this Trial Chamber has assigned me the Pre-Trial Judge for this case. You
25 may file your motion for the amendment of the indictment to me. Thank
2 Is there any matter that Defence wishes to raise at this stage?
3 Mr. Kastratovic?
4 MR. S. KASTRATOVIC: [Interpretation] Yes, Your Honour. On behalf
5 of my client, Mr. Milan Martic, and in my own name, I should like to raise
6 several important matters, several fundamental facts which determine our
7 attitude to this Tribunal. I have trusted the fairness of this Tribunal
8 ever since the day when my country was readmitted to the United Nations
9 and ever since I have not distinguished between the courts in my country
10 and this Court. My client, Mr. Milan Martic, began to trust this Tribunal
11 somewhat later, when the democratic authority was instituted in our
12 country and when cooperation with the Tribunal started. Since then,
13 Mr. Milan Martic thought it his civic duty to --
14 JUDGE LIU: Excuse me to interrupt you, Mr. Kastratovic. You have
15 to understand that whatever you said has to be translated into English and
16 French, the two official languages of this Tribunal. So please speak
17 slowly and make a stop at every sentence so that the interpreter and the
18 Court reporter to catch up with you. I'm sorry for the interruption. You
19 may proceed.
20 MR. S. KASTRATOVIC: [Interpretation] My apologies, Your Honour,
21 and I will repeat only my last sentence. From that time on, the accused
22 Martic has considered it his civil duty to surrender himself to this
23 Honourable Court, believing in its good faith and fairness and trusting
24 that, in an unbiased procedure, through me, he will prove what he
25 intends to prove. Needless to say, you have already decided that
1 Mr. Martic be kept into detention. I would not insist on his release from
2 detention, because at this point in time I do not think that it would be
3 justified. I also wish to inform you that Mr. Martic and I will do our
4 best to very quickly, in a written submission, define or lay down the
5 principal points of our defence, to establish facts which are in dispute
6 and which are not in dispute, so as not -- bigger problem from what
7 already is a problem, and thus encumber the Court more. I hope that we
8 shall be able to resolve a number of questions with the Prosecutor before
9 the main hearing, and that when the trial starts, you will have to deal
10 only with matters which we have not been able to settle between us.
11 As I have said, we do not want this case to be procrastinated
12 because it would be at the expense of the Court, of my client and of
13 justice. You will find in us collaborators who will abide by the
14 procedure as envisaged by the Rules.
15 Thank you very much.
16 JUDGE LIU: Thank you very much. Madam Prosecutor, although you
17 have informed this Trial Chamber that you have already disclosed
18 supporting material, but for the record, I have to remind you that
19 pursuant to Rule 66 of the Rules of Procedure and Evidence, it has 30 days
20 to disclose the supporting materials with the indictment. And Defence is
21 advised that it will have 30 days period for filing any preliminary
22 motions once it has received all the supporting material in accordance
23 with Rule 66 of the rules. You may challenge the jurisdiction as well as
24 file any other motions like the motion for the provisional release of your
25 client. For the expeditious preparation of the case, a Status Conference
1 will be scheduled within 120 days from today, pursuant to Rule 65 bis (A).
2 I believe that's all for this initial appearance.
3 I will now adjourn the proceedings.
4 ---Whereupon the Initial Appearance
5 adjourned at 2.56 p.m.