Tribunal Criminal Tribunal for the Former Yugoslavia

Page 9631

1 Monday, 17 June 2002

2 [Status Conference]

3 [Open session]

4 --- Upon commencing at 1.18 p.m.

5 JUDGE MUMBA: This is a Status Conference to look at the state of

6 affairs regarding witnesses. Since we've been unable to continue for the

7 rest of the morning and we are not sure whether we shall have the witness

8 on Wednesday, the Trial Chamber wanted to find out from the Prosecution if

9 they can bring a witness for Wednesday.

10 MR. WEINER: Good afternoon.

11 JUDGE MUMBA: I note that the accused are not present, but it's

12 not necessary for them to be present.

13 MR. WEINER: Good afternoon. I spoke with Ewa Tabeau, and she

14 would be available. It's Wednesday afternoon, if I'm correct.

15 JUDGE MUMBA: Gentlemen. From Wednesday it's afternoon until the

16 end of June.

17 MR. WEINER: He yes. She would be available for this Wednesday,

18 if necessary. If Mr. Todorovic is unable to testify, we could put Ewa

19 Tabeau on. If they're prepared -- because it's --

20 JUDGE MUMBA: Yes, Mr. Pantelic.

21 MR. PANTELIC: Your Honour, we are always cooperative with our

22 friends and with the Trial Chamber with regard to the proceedings and

23 stuff like that. In this particular matter, I would like to tell you:

24 Yes, we know that Ms. Ewa Tabeau will come as an expert witness. We've

25 been working on that topic since. But Your Honours, we are in big

Page 9632

1 problem. For example, I myself, I'm in the middle of preparation of the

2 cross-examination of Mr. Todorovic, who is quite important witness,

3 especially for my client. It would be rather difficult now to shift or to

4 wait whether we shall have him or Ms. Tabeau. Another matter which is

5 important: We Defence counsel, prior to these hearings, we, in the last

6 couple of weeks, we divided our portions of possible cross-examination of

7 Ms. Ewa Tabeau. Thirdly, Mr. Pisarevic is away. He is a part of the team

8 of Defence counsel who will give certain cross. He will be back on I

9 believe Monday. Mr. Lukic is leaving tomorrow. Only I am here. And for

10 this really specific reasons, we are in problem how to rearrange, how to

11 organise our cross for Ms. Ewa Tabeau.

12 JUDGE MUMBA: Yes, Mr. Pantelic, but it has always been a rule in

13 the Tribunal that Defence counsel must always be prepared for the

14 Prosecution case. This is not the first time that we have to change

15 witnesses because of certain circumstances that have arisen, that has

16 happened before.

17 MR. PANTELIC: I absolutely agree, Your Honour, but this is a

18 specific situation. You can understand my position with this witness

19 testifying against my client. This is a really important witness as well

20 as for Prosecution. And also, Ms. Ewa Tabeau is also of great importance

21 for the, of course, Prosecution and us. So it's unfortunate event that

22 these two particular witnesses are now overlapping, so to say, and we have

23 to work.


25 MR. PANTELIC: I mean --

Page 9633

1 JUDGE MUMBA: I'm afraid that has to be the case. We shall just

2 have to overlap. Because we just can't wait for the other witness when we

3 don't know when his pain will be dealt with by the dentist. We will have

4 another witness on Wednesday. Tomorrow we aren't sitting because we

5 haven't got a courtroom.

6 MR. PANTELIC: If you permit me, Your Honour, if maybe our learned

7 friend can maybe arrange a videolink with the other witness or maybe

8 someone who is nearby, maybe Ms. Kapetanovic.

9 JUDGE MUMBA: It's not possible, because the Trial Chamber did

10 look at all those possibilities. It's not possible. Because we don't

11 want also to interrupt the closed session for too long because of the fact

12 that the witness is a serving prisoner.

13 MR. WEINER: Your Honour --

14 JUDGE MUMBA: Yes, Mr. Weiner.

15 MR. WEINER: I might have somewhat of an alternative. It might be

16 helpful to everybody involved. Ms. Tabeau, as you know, within her

17 statement has all sorts of charts. I could put her on the witness stand,

18 have her -- show the charts here, have her demonstrate the basis of each

19 of the charts, basically bring her through a limited direct examination

20 which would probably last an hour, hour and a half, which would take up

21 some of the day, a good part of the afternoon and if they would want to

22 cross-examine her next week, I'd have no objection, if that would make it

23 easier for them and have their attorneys back that have to do that

24 cross-examination. If that would -- if that's what the Court wants. But

25 I could be ready at least to take part of the afternoon. Also, we're

Page 9634

1 filing some motions on video conferencing, as well as protective orders,

2 so there are other matters that we will be filing today which the Court

3 could take up at least a good part of the day on Wednesday. If that's

4 what the Court wants. I'm filing -- I'll give you some background. I'm

5 filing protective orders on three witnesses today which two have been --

6 actually, all three have been interviewed will be 92 bis witnesses, as

7 well as a video conferencing for Mr. Hasan Subasic. Hasan Subasic is the

8 witness that is living in Salt Lake City Utah, within the United States.

9 Mr. Subasic was supposed to be here and testify just before this witness

10 who is on now, either that or just after this witness. Mr. Subasic was

11 involved in a car accident within the month, has a broken collarbone,

12 broken arm, broke ribs. It would be practically impossible for him in

13 that condition to travel, so we'll be filing a motion based on that to do

14 videolinking within the United States, probably through the federal

15 district court in -- wherever it is within Utah. So we have to view that

16 motion. Whatever the Court would like, we're here to help. If there's

17 going to be a problem on cross and you need something, we can do the

18 motions, administrative matters, and I will put her on for direct

19 examination, go through her charts and do whatever is necessary.

20 MR. PANTELIC: I'm really grateful to my learned friend. Thank

21 you very much. That would be really -- help us.

22 [Trial Chamber confers]

23 JUDGE MUMBA: Yes, Mr. Pantelic. You are agreeable to what

24 Mr. Weiner suggested. All right.

25 MR. PANTELIC: Absolutely. I'm really much a obliged to the words

Page 9635

1 of my learned friend, really. Thank you very much.

2 MR. WEINER: And we'll get the motions that we're filing today.

3 They will all be in the Defence counsel room at the end of the day, so

4 they will have a chance to study them and be prepared to answer in court

5 on Wednesday to the government's or the Prosecution's motions.

6 JUDGE MUMBA: All right. So we'll have that witness, Ms. Ewa

7 Tabeau, on Wednesday. We are starting our proceedings at 1415. In the

8 event that the continuing witness is not well enough to continue. All

9 right.

10 MR. WEINER: Just as an aside, Your Honour, is there any

11 information from the Registry as to a dental appointment or have we

12 learned any --

13 JUDGE MUMBA: The Trial Chamber has been informed that everything

14 is being done to get an appointment as quickly as possible, yes, so that

15 he can be attended to.

16 MR. WEINER: Okay. Thank you.

17 MR. PANTELIC: Thank you, Your Honours.

18 [Trial Chamber confers]

19 JUDGE MUMBA: Very well, then. We shall adjourn until Wednesday

20 at --

21 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] Excuse me, Your Honour.

22 JUDGE MUMBA: Yes, Mr. Lukic.

23 MR. LUKIC: [Interpretation] As there are no other subjects,

24 colleague Pantelic already informed me, and the Registry informed me. I

25 have another 20 minutes concerning my cross-examination, and I hoped to

Page 9636

1 conclude it today. However, this unforeseeable circumstance concerning

2 the health of the witness occurred. And I talked to Mr. Tadic. We agreed

3 that Mr. Krgovic would then carry on the next 20 minutes, although the

4 registrar already mentioned that I would have these 20 minutes which

5 Mr. Krgovic will then carry on. And I wanted to confirm, in connection

6 with Madam Ewa Tabeau, we have divided the various areas we will be

7 covering in our cross. I have also some talks with our investigators.

8 Therefore, I'm grateful to the Prosecution for this proposal of theirs how

9 to organise with the expert witness Ewa Tabeau and then from Monday

10 onwards we'll be present here. Thank you.

11 JUDGE MUMBA: Yes. Co-counsel can always continue and complete

12 the cross-examination when the witness is well enough to continue.

13 So we'll adjourn until Wednesday at 1415 hours.

14 --- Whereupon the Status Conference adjourned at

15 1.29 a.m.