Tribunal Criminal Tribunal for the Former Yugoslavia

Page 26109

1 Thursday, 4 September 2003

2 [Open session]

3 --- Upon commencing at 9.22 a.m.

4 JUDGE MAY: Mr. Nice, we have a report, the accused not being

5 here, that he's unwell. This is the eighth occasion or so that this has

6 happened, and I think some fifty or so days have been lost due to his

7 illness. Plainly, this is a matter which requires investigation. We

8 propose, therefore, to have a full medical report upon the accused,

9 including a report upon his psychological condition.

10 MR. NICE: An observation --

11 JUDGE MAY: And also -- let me finish. We also propose to have a

12 report from the Detention Unit upon his conditions and his conduct.

13 Yes.

14 MR. NICE: Forgive my appearing to have interrupted, Your Honour.

15 I hadn't appreciated that you hadn't concluded. We, of course, have no

16 substantial observations to make, save perhaps the following:

17 When the Chamber looks at the overall history of his medical

18 condition and how, if at all, to approach the same potential problem for

19 the future, there is -- it may be something of a pattern of his health

20 being less satisfactory following the more difficult evidence. I'm not

21 suggesting for one minute that his ill health is other than genuine,

22 because it appears from all the reports it's entirely genuine, but it does

23 appear that, to our non-expert eyes, that indisposition sometimes follows

24 the more difficult evidence that he has to deal with. And I mention it

25 not to reopen the question of imposition of counsel, because we understand

Page 26110

1 that matter has been dealt with and conclusively dealt with, but --

2 JUDGE MAY: [Microphone not activated]

3 THE INTERPRETER: Microphone for the Presiding Judge, please.

4 JUDGE MAY: The matter was ruled upon, but it was left open. We

5 said we would keep the position under review, and we shall.

6 MR. NICE: Well, then, what I had in mind to say was that in

7 looking to the future, and in particular looking to the Defence part of

8 the case, if the Chamber can think of a mechanism - we discussed one or

9 two earlier in the week - whereby there can be some assistance given to

10 him in the conduct of the case that may relieve him of the -- the worst

11 tension that could follow the most difficult evidence, then that might be

12 helpful. It's hard to see exactly how that could happen, save by the

13 imposition of counsel or by the addition of standby counsel. But of

14 course, when somebody is facing a case substantially on his own, the

15 tension of the moment is the more difficult to bear, I suppose, if you

16 haven't got anybody to assist you with it.

17 But this is very much a layman's response over the last year and a

18 half or whatever it is to what we've seen.

19 The second thing is that as to the immediate problem -- the

20 immediate timetable position, we've got witnesses available today, so they

21 will be here available tomorrow and I suspect could be kept over till

22 Monday. If by any chance the accused should return to health sufficiently

23 to sit either tomorrow or on Monday, should the Court be able to do that?

24 I don't think we have any other observations we'd want to make.

25 JUDGE MAY: Yes, Mr. Tapuskovic.

Page 26111












12 Blank page inserted to ensure pagination corresponds between the French and

13 English transcripts.













Page 26112

1 MR. TAPUSKOVIC: [Interpretation] Your Honours, if I may be of

2 assistance to the Chamber. Of course, I do believe that your position

3 regarding investigating this problem, which arises occasionally, is quite

4 in order. Of course, you know that we amicus have no official contact

5 with Mr. Slobodan Milosevic. But on the basis of informal contacts that

6 we occasionally have, both myself and Mr. Kay - I can tell you that quite

7 openly - there are no advisory conversations but spontaneous conversations

8 that we have occasionally in the small breaks, and what I heard over the

9 past few days -- or rather, yesterday and the day before in informal

10 contact was that the transport after the end of the hearing is several

11 hours late, and he's left in these premises without the possibility of

12 having a rest until sometimes as late as 4.00. I was told this by him the

13 day before yesterday.

14 Also, the day when we had the hearing in the afternoon he did

15 complain that he didn't have time to rest. And I think that these are

16 matters that should also be investigated, that is, how the transportation

17 functions in the morning and after the hearings, because we do believe,

18 that is, both Mr. Kay and myself, that it is absolutely essential for the

19 accused to have time to rest. And this could also contribute to a

20 worsening of his condition. Because I am sure you have noticed when he

21 has four days of rest, when we have that longer break, very rarely did he

22 after that have any indisposition. So I think that in addition to these

23 other matters that you mentioned, I think also these should be looked

24 into, regarding transportation and the rest.

25 JUDGE MAY: Yes. Thank you.

Page 26113

1 MR. TAPUSKOVIC: [Interpretation] Thank you, Your Honour.

2 JUDGE MAY: We will require a report upon the transport of the

3 accused to and from the Detention Unit on a daily basis, because we want

4 to be sure that that is operating effectively and not causing unnecessary

5 complications.

6 [Trial Chamber confers]

7 JUDGE MAY: We've considered whether we could sit those two extra

8 days. And obviously if we could, that would be helpful. Because of

9 arrangements which have been made, we could not sit on Monday, but we

10 could, if the accused were fit enough, sit, two of us at least, tomorrow.

11 MR. NICE: That's helpful.

12 And Your Honour, I meant to mention that there were four

13 outstanding motions, resolution of which will affect witnesses in the next

14 week. And I think -- I think the identity of those motions has been

15 provided informally to Mr. Boas.

16 JUDGE MAY: If there are additional motions, two -- we've dealt

17 with two. Two more no doubt we can look at.

18 Very well. We'll adjourn now.

19 --- Whereupon the hearing adjourned

20 at 9.33 a.m. sine die.