Tribunal Criminal Tribunal for the Former Yugoslavia

Page 7116

 1                           Wednesday, 3 March 2010

 2                           [Open session]

 3                           [The accused entered court]

 4                           --- Upon commencing at 9.09 a.m.

 5             THE REGISTRAR:  Good morning, Your Honours.

 6             This is case IT-08-91-T, the Prosecutor versus Mico Stanisic and

 7     Stojan Zupljanin.

 8             JUDGE HALL:  Good morning to all.  Before we revert to closed

 9     session, I will take the appearances for today.

10             MR. DOBBYN:  Good morning, Your Honours.  For the Office of the

11     Prosecutor, Gerard Dobbyn, with Joanna Korner, and our Case Manager

12     Crispian Smith.

13             MR. ZECEVIC:  Good morning, Your Honours.  Slobodan Zecevic,

14     Slobodan Cvijetic, Ms. Deirdre Montgomery, and Ms. Tatjana Savic

15     appearing for Stanisic Defence this morning.  Thank you.

16             MR. PANTELIC:  Good morning, Your Honours.  For Zupljanin Defence

17     this morning appearing, Igor Pantelic, Dragan Krgovic, and

18     Stephanie Cagnet.  Thank you.

19             JUDGE HALL:  Thank you.  If there is nothing that we need to

20     detain us --

21             MR. ZECEVIC:  I'm sorry, Your Honour, if I correctly remember,

22     you instructed us to give you the --

23             JUDGE HALL:  Yes.

24             MR. ZECEVIC:  The oral submissions on request.  We could do it

25     now or we can do it later.  It's up to Your Honours.

Page 7117

 1             JUDGE HALL:  I expect that this -- the witness now in the box

 2     would not take the whole of today, so perhaps at the end of today --

 3             MR. ZECEVIC:  Thank you.  I understand.

 4             JUDGE HALL:  When the witness has been released would be a more

 5     convenient time.

 6             MR. ZECEVIC:  I appreciate it.

 7             JUDGE HALL:  Yes, thank you.

 8             So we revert to closed session.  And if the usher would escort

 9     the witness back to the stand.

10                           [Closed session]

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11 Pages 7118-7190 redacted. Closed session.















Page 7191

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10                           [Open session]

11             THE REGISTRAR:  Your Honours, we're in open session.

12             JUDGE HALL:  Yes, Mr. Zecevic.

13             MR. ZECEVIC:  Your Honours, you instructed us to orally respond

14     to -- in the course of today on motion for additional --

15             JUDGE HALL: [Microphone not activated]

16             MR. ZECEVIC:  Yes, thank you very much.

17             Your Honours, I would -- I would be very short.

18             The -- our understanding is that the standard for adding

19     documents to the 65 ter list is stated in the oral decision of

20     25th February, 2010.  Among others, this Trial Chamber stressed:

21             "... factors to be taken in consideration include good cause, due

22     diligence, lack of undue prejudice to the Defence, and judicial economy."

23             Those are the four reasons.

24             I can give you the -- the transcript reference is page 6857.

25             However, the present motion that we are -- that we are supposed

Page 7192

 1     to give our position to, for some reason, does not even quote these

 2     factors nor gives any kind of explanation whether the -- the situation,

 3     as it is, is in conformity with the Trial Chamber's decision and if

 4     the -- if the -- the requirements are met.

 5             Therefore, we object to -- to this motion.

 6             Thank you very much.

 7             JUDGE HALL: [Microphone not activated]

 8             MR. PANTELIC:  And if I may, on the same subject, Your Honours.

 9             The position of Zupljanin Defence is following:  I stand

10     corrected, of course, we have 2678 65 ter documents, and plus, I believe,

11     eight additional through this witness.

12             I mean, on a almost daily basis we are coming to the situation

13     where we are overloaded with this approach to -- to amend 65 ter list,

14     and then inevitably at certain stage we shall be in sort of confusion

15     where we are with the numbers, which kind of documents, et cetera.

16             I would like to outline the -- the following standard and

17     position.  I think that I really have a understanding of -- of the

18     position of the Prosecution.  It's a living matter.  Trial is evolving

19     and developing.  But certain standards and levels should be imposed.

20     What is the weight of -- of particular exhibits, especially in light of

21     the thousands of already 65 ter documents.  So I think with a sort of

22     relaxed approach towards the -- the -- the request of the Prosecution, we

23     are entering into the phase where we shall be overloaded and we shall

24     be -- we shall lost the quality of this kind of documents.

25             The rule of the game is very simple.  You have a deadline for a

Page 7193

 1     submission of 65 ter list, and then a good cause should be shown, and a

 2     certain standard of -- of the quality of that particular document.

 3             For example, we are facing a numerous approach by the Prosecution

 4     regarding, for example, photos or maps or -- or all other -- I really

 5     don't like to be understand -- understood incorrectly.  But, I mean, it

 6     is not important for the case.  Thousands of documents are here.  And

 7     we -- we have almost a clear picture.  If the Prosecution would like to

 8     add every day and every -- every two -- two days some other documents, I

 9     mean, what is the case of the Prosecution for Christ's sake?  What they

10     have as a case, if they didn't tailor and create their case well in

11     advance.  This indictment was filed in, correct me, 1999, 11 years ago.

12             I mean, speaking of my client, Mr. Zupljanin.  Where we are now?

13     It's a very simple case, Your Honour?  They don't have -- they don't have

14     any particular proofs of criminal conduct of my client, so they are

15     trying to enlarge this strategy, you know, with whole JCE concept, you

16     know, umbrella crime, politics, constitutional issues, division,

17     et cetera.  Where we are with this case?  This is a criminal case,

18     Your Honour.  Where are the proofs against my client, A, B, C, and D?

19     End of story.

20             Thank you.

21             JUDGE HALL:  I assume, Mr. Pantelic, that your general criticism

22     means that you specifically object to the present application?

23             MR. PANTELIC:  Absolutely, Your Honour.  Absolutely.  I stand

24     with this submission.  Thank you.

25             MS. KORNER:  Your Honour, may I briefly respond to this.  First

Page 7194

 1     of all, it's not right to say that the written motion filed in respect of

 2     the three documents that we wish to add ignored the ruling.  It

 3     specifically refers to the ruling of the 25th of last month.

 4             Your Honours, it is, I'm sure understood by all in this

 5     courtroom, as Mr. Pantelic puts it, that a trial is an evolving thing and

 6     that were the -- at the beginning of the trial, the positions of the

 7     parties, including the Defence, to be set out very clearly what is in

 8     issue.  And I have no doubt at all that things might be a lot more

 9     stream-lined.

10             Both Defence counsel have appeared in trials before this Tribunal

11     before.  Mr. Zecevic, in particular.  It is perhaps worth reminding

12     Defence counsel that it's not just the Prosecution in all the trials who

13     have filed motions to amend their 65 ter lists.  In the Milutinovic case,

14     in which Mr. Zecevic was involved, the Defence filed no less than

15     28 motions, in order to amend their 65 ter list.

16             Neither Defence counsel today has pointed to any prejudice that

17     is caused to their case by photographs, two photographs, of what we

18     believe to be crime sites in the Vlasenica municipality, how that is in

19     any way going to put them at a disadvantage or cause them any prejudice,

20     or the crime register for the SJB.  But all of these matters have been

21     disclosed.  We understood the rational behind the ruling on the

22     25th of February was because of late application so that not sufficient

23     notice was given to the Defence.

24             In this case, we've given ample notice, we hope, Your Honours, to

25     the Defence of what we would wish to use.  We submit that it is in the

Page 7195

 1     interests of justice for Your Honours to grants our application.

 2             JUDGE HALL:  Thank you.

 3                           [Trial Chamber confers]

 4             JUDGE HALL:  Ms. Korner, could you remind us as to what your

 5     application embraces in terms of items.

 6             MS. KORNER:  The application is to add three exhibits to the

 7     65 ter list to be dealt with by witnesses who are coming next week.

 8             The proposed ones are photographs of two crime sites in

 9     Vlasenica, which is the municipality that will be dealt with next week.

10             And the third one is the crime register for the SJB.  And

11     witnesses -- Your Honours we're filing we don't actually know whether the

12     witness can deal with it as pointed out in the motion.  We're filing this

13     application on the basis we're going to invite them when they arrive next

14     week to look at them and see whether they can assist.

15             So we're giving notice of that.

16             JUDGE HALL:  Thank you.

17             So the Chamber accedes to the motion of the Prosecution for the

18     addition of these three items to its 65 ter list.

19             MS. KORNER:  Thank you.

20                           [Trial Chamber confers]

21             JUDGE HALL:  So with that, we take the adjournment to 2.15

22     tomorrow afternoon in Courtroom I.

23                            --- Whereupon the hearing adjourned at 1.38 p.m.,

24                           to be reconvened on Thursday, the 4th day

25                           of March, 2010, at 2.15 p.m.