Page 7270
1 Friday, 5 March 2010
2 [Open session]
3 [The accused entered court]
4 [The witness takes the stand]
5 --- Upon commencing at 2.18 p.m.
6 THE REGISTRAR: Good afternoon, Your Honours.
7 This is case IT-08-91-T, the Prosecutor versus Mico Stanisic and
8 Stojan Zupljanin.
9 JUDGE HALL
10 Good afternoon to everyone. I, first of all, note for the record
11 that in the absence of Judge Delvoie, we're sitting today under
12 Rule 15 bis.
13 May we have the appearances, please.
14 MS. KORNER: Good afternoon, Your Honours. Joanna Korner and
15 Crispian Smith for the Prosecution.
16 MR. CVIJETIC: [Interpretation] Good afternoon, Your Honours. On
17 behalf of defence of Mr. Stanisic, Slobodan Cvijetic and
18 Deirdre Montgomery
19 MR. PANTELIC: Good afternoon, Your Honours. For
20 Zupljanin Defence this afternoon appearing, Igor Pantelic,
21 Dragan Krgovic, and Miroslav Cuskic. Thank you.
22 JUDGE HALL
23 Yesterday it was brought to my attention that we had forgotten
24 not to move out of private session, and I'm wondering whether the -- what
25 way you are now headed, Mr. Krgovic. We -- we -- we need to revert to
Page 7271
1 private session or whether we remain in open session. Could you -- could
2 you assist me in that regard?
3 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] Your Honours, I propose that we
4 stay in open session for a time. I will try to avoid mentioning the
5 position, the name, or any tasks performed (redacted)
6 (redacted)
7 (redacted)
8 before it goes out.
9 JUDGE HALL
10 MS. KORNER: Thank you.
11 JUDGE HALL
12 by magic, yesterday evening just after the adjournment the translation
13 of -- of the document in question appeared. So we are now ready to -- to
14 continue.
15 I take it, Ms. Korner, that you have seen it.
16 MS. KORNER: Yes, we have. Thank you very much, Your Honours.
17 JUDGE HALL
18 (redacted) before I invite Mr. Krgovic to continue -- sorry.
19 [Trial Chamber and Registrar confer]
20 JUDGE HALL
21 cross-examination, I remind that you're still on your oath.
22 Yes, Mr. Krgovic.
23 WITNESS: WITNESS ST-213 [Resumed]
24 [Witness answered through interpreter]
25 Cross-examination by Mr. Krgovic: [Continued]
Page 7272
1 Q. [Interpretation] To avoid any mention, I will address you as
2 Witness. I'm not going to use any determinant.
3 I'm trying to formulate my questions so that you can answer with
4 a yes or no, and if there are questions where you have to explain what
5 you did, then we will go into private session. And please signal
6 whenever you feel that you may divulge your identity by an answer, and I
7 will seek to go into private session.
8 Is that clear?
9 A. Yes.
10 Q. Yesterday I showed you this document. It's still before you.
11 Have you had a chance to look at that it? First of all, I showed you the
12 first and last page. Now, go to page 2 of the document, please.
13 Does this document, in principle, contain everything that a
14 document of such nature should contain?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. Does this seem as an authentic document, dating from that period?
17 A. Yes.
18 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] Your Honours, if there's no
19 objection, I would like to tender this document into evidence.
20 MS. KORNER: Your Honours, I'm not at all sure that the witness
21 can testify as to its authenticity or not, but have I no objection to it
22 going in, because the signature and stamp have been identified.
23 JUDGE HALL
24 THE REGISTRAR: As Exhibit 2D52, Your Honours.
25 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation]
Page 7273
1 Q. Witness, please take a look at page 12 of this document.
2 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] That would be page 11 in the
3 English version. I don't know how it is in e-court. Could be the next
4 page. That would be page 12 in the English version. I think ...
5 I apologise, just a second, please.
6 Well, since, in e-court, pages are not the same as the document
7 pages, that would be the next page in e-court, please. In English. The
8 B/C/S version is okay.
9 So I apologise. The versions are different. In English, the
10 exhibit number is 2D02-1191.
11 MS. KORNER: [Microphone not activated]
12 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] Page 12 in the English version, I
13 think.
14 It is page 11 in English, after all. That would be the right
15 page. Yes, thanks.
16 Q. In paragraph 2, that would be the last sentence, there is a piece
17 of information concerning the number of received and sent dispatches, and
18 it says that in the first nine months, in 1991, covered by this report,
19 180, 160.168 dispatches and 335.858 have been received. In other words,
20 188.168 were received and, 39.858 were sent. Do you agree? Do you agree
21 that this is stated in the document?
22 A. Yes, I see it. It is stated so.
23 Q. You have no reason to believe that this is incorrect?
24 A. I do not have any information that this would be incorrect.
25 MS. KORNER: Your Honours, I don't want to object. But I don't
Page 7274
1 think the witness is being asked whether this document is one that the
2 witness has ever seen before. Because, as you notice, I didn't deal with
3 the content except when I was dealing with it. And if the witness has
4 not seen it before, then this just really a method of just reading out
5 what's in the document.
6 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] Your Honours, if I may respond.
7 My examination is linking up with Madam Korner's examination.
8 She broached the subject of the number of dispatches that went through
9 the witness's hands in a certain period of time, and it is my intention
10 to clarify this matter, to see the period that we are dealing with, to
11 compare 1991 to 1992. And on the basis of that, to ask the witness to
12 confirm certain facts. This is the gist of my using this document.
13 MS. KORNER: Well, Your Honours, again, I mean, I don't want to
14 delay matters. I think that it was put to the witness yesterday that
15 dispatches were matters that were done by telecommunication and were sent
16 by Mr. Rakovic. And that's a slightly -- there was a clear distinction
17 drawn between detaches and correspondence that came for the chief.
18 I don't know that the witness gave any evidence which suggested
19 that the witness had any knowledge of the numbers. But as I say, I mean,
20 rather than delay matters, I'm just putting that down for the record,
21 that how helpful the witness can be over this is something that's
22 completely different.
23 JUDGE HALL
24 of course, as Ms. Korner says, the content to separate - how should I
25 describe it? - the system from the contents. There's no point by way
Page 7275
1 of -- in the course of asking questions, in essence reading out the
2 contents of this document which the witness had no hand in making.
3 But -- so if you -- if you would bear that in mind, please proceed.
4 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] I will bear that in mind,
5 Your Honours.
6 Q. Witness, do you have any knowledge that, for instance, in 1991,
7 there was a large number of dispatches which reached you, which went
8 through the place where you worked at? By meaning -- by meaning -- by
9 saying "the place," I mean the institution that you worked at.
10 A. I mentioned that in -- during that year, there was a large number
11 of dispatches. I cannot say it was 180; it could have been 150 or 120.
12 It was a large number. And I cannot tell you whether 31 or 41.000 were
13 sent. I'm not certain about the exact figure, but there was a large
14 number of dispatches.
15 Q. When I mentioned these figures, I mean roughly. But this would
16 be a large number which corresponds to the figure mentioned in the
17 report. Is that so?
18 A. Yes.
19 THE INTERPRETER: Microphone.
20 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] Let's take a look at, please, P595.
21 Can we see it on e-court, please.
22 Mr. Usher.
23 Q. [Interpretation] I'm going to give you a hard copy for
24 convenience.
25 Please take a look at page 1 of this document. This is a report
Page 7276
1 on the work of the centre from the 1st of January until the
2 30th of June, 1992.
3 And then take a look at the last page of this document, please.
4 Is this Mr. Zupljanin's signature?
5 A. Yes.
6 Q. And the stamp of your centre; is that correct?
7 A. Yes.
8 THE INTERPRETER: Microphone for counsel, please.
9 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation]
10 Q. Please go to page 17 in the B/C/S version.
11 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] That would be page 12 in the
12 English version.
13 Q. And at the bottom of the page, you will hear [as interpreted]
14 that there were 9.956 dispatches received and 9.686 sent. 728 coded
15 dispatches, and 898 coded dispatches were sent out, and 2.297 dispatches
16 were in transit.
17 Can you agree that this statement is here stated in the first six
18 months of 1992?
19 A. Yes, this report covers the first six months. The previous
20 report covered nine months. I did not do anything with respect to this
21 document, but I know that there was a large number of such dispatches.
22 Q. Now, please take a look at another document.
23 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] P621.
24 Q. I will give you a hard copy for your convenience.
25 Please take a look at the first page. That would be a report on
Page 7277
1 the work of the centre from -- for the period from 1st of July to
2 30th of September, 1992. And then take a look at the last page, please.
3 Is there a signature? Is this Mr. Zupljanin's signature?
4 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] No, the penultimate page. I
5 apologise.
6 THE WITNESS: [Interpretation] Although it is not typed, I
7 recognise Chief Stojan's signature.
8 Let me take a look at the stamp. And the stamp is authentic.
9 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation]
10 Q. Please take a look at page 14.
11 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] In English, that would be page 31.
12 In the Serbian version, that would be ERN 0074-9631.
13 Q. So we are dealing with another three months. The previous
14 document dealt with 1991, nine months, then I showed you a report
15 covering the first six months of 1992, and then another, which covers
16 three months of 1992. It states here that 1996 uncoded dispatches were
17 received and 162 coded were received. 1.396 were received, and 43 were
18 sent.
19 Is that right?
20 A. Yes. It states so here.
21 Q. If we compare 1991 and 1992, the same periods, in 1991, we will
22 see in the first nine months in peacetime there were 228.026 dispatches
23 received. And in the first nine months in 1992, 27.151, which would be
24 10 per cent of the number from 1991.
25 So this number is much smaller than the figure from peacetime.
Page 7278
1 A. Well, on the basis of the information that communications service
2 prepared, this would be so.
3 Q. And when you voiced your estimates on the number of dispatches
4 that went through your hands, that figure would be how far you could
5 understand or recall. You gave us an average number of dispatches that
6 went through your hands, not the exact?
7 A. Yes, that's correct.
8 Q. The individuals who took care of communications were definitely
9 better placed to give estimations and figures involved?
10 A. Not only estimations, they had specific figures that they kept
11 records of.
12 Q. Precisely. That's what I meant. They had the exact numbers and
13 accurate records; is that right?
14 A. Yes.
15 THE INTERPRETER: Microphone, please.
16 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation]
17 Q. The Prosecutor showed you a document yesterday, which is P569,
18 that I will show you now.
19 This is a fax message, is it not?
20 A. Not a fax message. It's a dispatch.
21 Q. But it was sent through a fax machine.
22 A. I don't want to go into the work that -- done by the encryption
23 people, but a fax would have a -- or, rather, there should be a
24 DD reference at the top there. It should state "communications centre."
25 I don't think that it went through a fax.
Page 7279
1 Q. Can you direct your attention to the middle part of the document.
2 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] And can this number in the middle
3 be enlarged, please. Above where it states "page 2."
4 Q. Can you see it now? 13th June 1992, 2943 [as interpreted] and
5 this number, 39155. Are you familiar with this number?
6 A. I'm not. And I don't know what sort of procedure was used in the
7 communications centre once they received a dispatch. But the number,
8 078, is the Banja Luka prefix. But I didn't work in the communications
9 centre in order for me to be able to know what means they used.
10 Q. That's clear.
11 THE INTERPRETER: Microphone, please.
12 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] Can we call up 65 ter document 230.
13 Q. This is a report from 1992. Can you help us here? This
14 reference 11-1/02, that's the general crime department reference, is it
15 not?
16 A. Yes.
17 Q. This is a report on the arrest and arraignment of certain
18 individuals of Serb ethnicity who had committed crimes against the Muslim
19 population. And you see it is stated at the bottom:
20 "Chief of centre, Stojan Zupljanin."
21 But the signature is not his, is it?
22 A. No, it isn't.
23 Q. As discussed yesterday, the separate services which sent their
24 documents out, when doing so, they would have the chief sign it, and then
25 they would be sent out independently of you; is that right?
Page 7280
1 A. Yes. Independently of me, but the deputy chief was able to sign
2 such correspondence, and not the individual services.
3 Q. Perhaps I should have said a high-ranking official who had a
4 certain position and certain powers within the centre.
5 A. Yes.
6 THE INTERPRETER: Microphone, please.
7 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation]
8 Q. The number, 3400/92 in the upper right-hand corner, that's the
9 number of the crime registry where the criminal report was basically
10 filed. So it was the 3400th criminal report filed that year. Is that
11 right?
12 A. Yes, that's the number, and that's the crime register, right, KU.
13 Q. The date is the 28th of August, 1992?
14 A. Yes.
15 Q. And the stamp is that of the centre, right?
16 A. Yes.
17 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] Your Honours, I wish to tender this
18 document into evidence, unless there are any objections.
19 JUDGE HALL
20 THE REGISTRAR: As Exhibit 2D53, Your Honours.
21 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation]
22 Q. In answer to the Prosecutor's questions, you spoke of certain
23 references or designations placed on documents.
24 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] Let us look at P123, MFI.
25 THE INTERPRETER: Microphone, please.
Page 7281
1 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] Can I have the usher's assistance
2 in handing you this set of documents. These are photo copies that will
3 facilitate the examination. It is much easier to have documents in front
4 of you.
5 I'm interested in the document marked with number 8.
6 Q. Please look at page 1 of the document, and I'm interested in the
7 top part of it.
8 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] And can we have the same portion
9 enlarged on our screens.
10 Q. This is a document from the Security Services Centre, public
11 security centre of -- station of Sanski Most, which was sent to the
12 chief. It's not a dispatch. In fact, you called it differently. What
13 was the term that you used?
14 A. A strictly confidential document.
15 Q. There's a handwritten note here. It seems to me that these are
16 Mr. Zupljanin's initials, are they not?
17 A. There where 02 is written, it is his initials, yes.
18 Q. It says here the corps HQ and the MUP are to be notified. And
19 below that, we have Stojan Zupljanin's initials. Is that right?
20 A. Yes.
21 Q. We have 02 reference at the top again standing for the general
22 crime department.
23 A. Crime department is 02. In other words, who is to be charged
24 with the task.
25 Q. It follows from here that when Stojan Zupljanin received the
Page 7282
1 dispatch, he immediately forwarded it to the corps HQ and the head office
2 of MUP; is that right?
3 A. According to the reference, he tasked the sector 02 with this,
4 told them what to do, and placed his initials next to that.
5 MS. KORNER: Sorry. Could the witness just read out the whole
6 thing so we get an accurate translation of what is on the letter? I
7 simply -- I think that Mr. Krgovic's was a slight summary.
8 So if the witness just reads it out.
9 JUDGE HALL
10 the top right corner?
11 MS. KORNER: [Microphone not activated] Yes.
12 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation]
13 Q. You heard Ms. Korner. Could you read out the entire handwritten
14 part.
15 A. "02," underlined, "notify the corps headquarters, or command, and
16 MUP."
17 Q. And below that is Mr. Zupljanin's signature, is it not?
18 A. His initials.
19 Q. What else is written there to the left?
20 A. It says: "Djukic."
21 And the rest, I can't make out.
22 Q. Do you know of a Djukic who worked for the general crime
23 department at the time?
24 A. Yes. I believe that there was a Dusko Djukic, an inspector in
25 the crime service.
Page 7283
1 Q. What we have there is a different handwriting on the same letter,
2 slightly to the left, and in somewhat darker ink.
3 A. No.
4 THE INTERPRETER: The interpreter notes we didn't hear
5 Mr. Krgovic's last parts of the question because the microphone was
6 switched off.
7 JUDGE HARHOFF: Mr. Krgovic, could you please repeat your
8 question.
9 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] I asked the witness if he
10 could read the part of the text, and (redacted) answered no.
11 MS. KORNER: [Microphone not activated] Both sexes, I suppose.
12 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] I wanted to shorten the procedure.
13 Q. I apologise, Witness. When I was drawing your attention to the
14 handwriting part in darker ink, I asked you if you could read what was
15 written there, and the interpreters didn't hear this part of my question.
16 So could you please repeat your answer, since I've repeated it
17 myself. But can you make out what is written there in the darker ink?
18 A. No, I cannot.
19 Q. Can you assist us with the following.
20 MS. KORNER: Your Honours, if Mr. Krgovic is moving to another
21 document, in the light of the witness's answers, can I move now that that
22 document be fully exhibited, as opposed to being MFI'd?
23 JUDGE HALL
24 THE REGISTRAR: As Exhibit P123, Your Honours.
25 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] We're interested in 2D38, MFI.
Page 7284
1 It's under 2 in the set of documents you have.
2 Look at page 2 of the document. There's a handwritten note which
3 says on the 27th of August, 1991 ... there is something handwritten
4 there. Can you make out?
5 A. Next to number 11, 230. That's an entry I made, in my own hand.
6 THE INTERPRETER: Microphone.
7 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation]
8 Q. Can you please turn to page 2 of the document.
9 We have the stamp there of the centre, and the signature of the
10 chief, Zupljanin; is that right?
11 A. Yes.
12 Q. And it does seem to be an authentic document from the period.
13 A. Yes.
14 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] Your Honours, I would like to have
15 this document fully exhibited now, the one that has been MFI'd, if there
16 are no objections.
17 MS. KORNER: No objection at all, Your Honour. I'm just trying
18 to, however, find the part by number 11 in which the witness said it was
19 the witness's writing.
20 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] That's in the original in a
21 handwritten number 11, 11-230.
22 MS. KORNER: Thank you. No objection.
23 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] Can we have 2D40, MFI.
24 Q. That's behind tab 4 for your benefit.
25 This is a 5th of December, 1991 report. And can you please look
Page 7285
1 at the last page of document.
2 JUDGE HALL
3 think that the last item was formally entered. So it's admitted and
4 marked as an exhibit.
5 THE REGISTRAR: As Exhibit 2D38, Your Honours.
6 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation]
7 Q. Look at the last page of the document, please. We have the seal,
8 or the stamp of the centre, and Stojan Zupljanin's signature. Is that
9 right?
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. And next to SSUP under "copies delivered to," we have someone's
12 handwriting. Do you know who it belongs to?
13 A. I don't.
14 Q. By its format and by the signature it bears, does it tally with
15 the documents you had occasion to see through your work at the
16 institution?
17 A. Yes. By the format and by the look of it, I should say it does,
18 but I have never seen this document before.
19 Q. Thank you.
20 THE INTERPRETER: Microphone for counsel, please.
21 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] The next, 2D2026 -- 1264. Can we
22 please have it on e-court. 2D02-1264.
23 Q. Please take look at the document on your screen. It will appear
24 any moment.
25 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] 2D02-1264.
Page 7286
1 Q. This is a dispatch. I would like -- what I'm interested in is
2 this designation 11-1/04-76. 11 was the designation of the
3 communications centre. Is that correct?
4 A. Yes.
5 Q. This went from this organ under the name of Stojan Zupljanin; is
6 that correct?
7 A. That's correct.
8 Q. Which doesn't mean that Stojan Zupljanin signed this document
9 personally. Most probably, communications centre chief signed him, since
10 it comes from this organ. Is that correct?
11 A. I do not know who signed it.
12 Q. One general question: Once a document is brought to the
13 communications centre and handed over to the person working there, that
14 person cannot -- when typing the message, the dispatch, they cannot type
15 the signature; they cannot transfer the image of the document from the
16 original. Is that correct?
17 A. Communications centre cannot receive a dispatch to be sent if
18 it's not signed.
19 Q. But when they do transfer it, they cannot transfer the original
20 signature. It just inserts a signature block. Is that correct?
21 A. Yes, that's correct, just the signature block.
22 Q. Although somebody else, pursuant to their authorisation, signed
23 the dispatch, the recipient cannot see at the place of destination what
24 the signature is. Is that correct?
25 A. That's -- that is something I don't know.
Page 7287
1 Q. Just another question: You discussed the circumstances during
2 war while you worked, and you mentioned the period where there were power
3 cuts. What I'm interested in: Do you recall that, in 1992, when the
4 corridor between Krajina and the rest of Bosnia-Herzegovina was cut off,
5 there were longer power cuts and people would throw out the food from
6 their refrigerators and their freezers because there was no electricity.
7 Do you recall that?
8 A. Yes, I do.
9 Q. Was that in 1992?
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. Thank you, Witness. This is -- this is all -- well, I apologise.
12 Just a second.
13 Thank you, I have no further questions for you.
14 JUDGE HALL
15 Mr. Cvijetic.
16 MR. CVIJETIC: [Interpretation] Your Honours, I have no questions
17 for this witness. Thank you.
18 JUDGE HALL
19 MS. KORNER: I have only one matter to deal with in
20 re-examination.
21 Before that, however, I'm just wondering whether I can return to
22 the slightly vexed subject of whether Mr. Krgovic would like to suggest
23 to the witness, if that's the case, that the identification of
24 Mr. Zupljanin's voice is right or wrong. It's returning to the old
25 question that I raised some weeks ago, but I do think, in the light of
Page 7288
1 this witness, whether, if there is -- it is disputed, that ought to be
2 made clear now. I don't -- I don't think we're likely to have a better
3 witness on that subject.
4 [Trial Chamber confers]
5 JUDGE HARHOFF: Ms. Korner, has this witness been confronted with
6 the intercepts?
7 MS. KORNER: Yes. Your Honour, you will recall that in the
8 evidence in chief and in the proofing note, the witness listened to - and
9 I gave the numbers - and positively identified -- identified is the wrong
10 word - I keep saying that - it's recognised the voice of Mr. Zupljanin.
11 JUDGE HARHOFF: On how many tapes? Forgive me for --
12 MS. KORNER: I said it fairly quickly, so Your Honours can be
13 forgiven for forgetting it.
14 It's a total of - one, two, three, four - five.
15 JUDGE HARHOFF: So you are now asking Mr. Krgovic to indicate
16 whether he will accept the witness's testimony that (redacted) did recognise
17 Stojan Zupljanin's voice on these five tapes?
18 MS. KORNER: Exactly. And I think it is appropriate.
19 MR. KRGOVIC: [Interpretation] Your Honours, in the light of your
20 decisions date 16th of December and yesterday's decision concerning the
21 intercepts, I believe that we -- I have no need to stipulate in respect
22 of this witness. I believe that this matter has been resolved in your
23 previous decisions, and we have the same situation that we used to have
24 before.
25 MS. KORNER: Can I just say it's not quite the same,
Page 7289
1 Your Honours. Your Honours have admitted the intercepts; they are part
2 of the evidence. That, in itself, doesn't specifically deal with the
3 accuracy or otherwise of who is speaking.
4 And, in any event, it is -- this evidence, if nothing else, is
5 solid, corroborative evidence of the evidence given by those who dealt
6 with the intercepts. And when Your Honours come to consider, at the end
7 of the day, the weight that you attach to that evidence, this is, we
8 submit, something that's quite important.
9 I -- I'm not -- I don't want to re-argue all the matters I argued
10 last time. I am merely raising it at this stage, because I think it is
11 appropriate.
12 [Trial Chamber confers]
13 JUDGE HALL
14 gave, and Mr. Krgovic's understanding of that ruling is consistent with
15 what we thought we had said, the -- if the Defence, for whatever reason,
16 chooses not to challenge or test this bit of evidence, the -- we would
17 have thought that the evidence stands and certain consequences would
18 follow. I shouldn't say would. Certain circumstances are likely to
19 follow. And I would have thought that experienced Defence counsel would
20 be acutely aware of that.
21 MS. KORNER: Yes, well -- I'm not going to labour the point. I
22 just thought this was an appropriate time mention it again.
23 Re-examination by Ms. Korner:
24 Q. Witness, I just want, for a moment, to go back to the document
25 that you were asked about, which is P595, I think. Yes.
Page 7290
1 MS. KORNER: And we'll need page 11 in the English, and page
2 17 in B/C/S.
3 Q. And it's paragraph 5.1 that I want you to look at when it comes
4 up on the screen.
5 I'm afraid it's a very bad copy, so if we can try -- it's talking
6 about -- and this is the 19 -- the six months of 1992, to June, the
7 functioning of the communications system and the cryptographic
8 protection.
9 Now, I just want to, first of all, before we look at this, to see
10 whether we've all understood correctly. The communications that you have
11 been calling dispatches were dealt with by the communications department,
12 is that right, under Mr. Rakovic?
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. But documents which were couriered --
15 MS. KORNER: Sorry, could we go into private session for a
16 moment.
17 JUDGE HALL
18 [Private session]
19 (redacted)
20 (redacted)
21 (redacted)
22 (redacted)
23 (redacted)
24 (redacted)
25 (redacted)
Page 7291
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16 [Open session]
17 THE REGISTRAR: Your Honours, we're now in open session.
18 MS. KORNER: Thank you.
19 Q. Witness, this report refers to the reduced number of
20 professionals working in the CSB
21 A. I was not concerned with personnel policy, and I didn't know
22 anything about it.
23 Q. I know you weren't concerned with personnel policy, but did you
24 yourself notice that people leaving --
25 MR. KRGOVIC: Asked and answered.
Page 7295
1 MS. KORNER: No, no, we're not in America, thank you.
2 Q. Did you yourself notice that people were leaving?
3 A. I personally would, on occasions, know of somebody leaving; but
4 that they were leaving en masse, no, I didn't know that. Because work
5 did not suffer. It was done by the people who were doing the job.
6 Q. So you don't understand, then, the reference in this report to
7 the reduced number of professionals, which, apparently, was also a
8 problem?
9 A. Probably.
10 Q. All right. I won't pursue that further.
11 Then it talks about repairs and establishments of links where
12 there had not been any before in Donji Vakuf, Krupa, and Kupres SJBs and
13 then due to war operations, there were constant interruptions in
14 telephone and telegraph links with some SJBs; Kupres, Donji Vakuf, Krupa,
15 Glamoc, Bihac, Teslic, Grahovo, Drvar, Sipovo, Mrkonjic Grad. From
16 your --
17 MS. KORNER: Sorry. I think back into private session, please,
18 for the next question.
19 JUDGE HALL
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10 [Open session]
11 JUDGE HALL
12 Tribunal and the assistance that you have afforded. And we wish that you
13 have a safe journey back to your home.
14 THE WITNESS: [Interpretation] Thank you.
15 JUDGE HALL
16 us further afternoon, in which case the witness need not be escorted out
17 of the court before the Court rises. And we would take the adjournment
18 to ...
19 [Trial Chamber and Registrar confer]
20 JUDGE HALL
21 And I trust that everyone has a safe weekend. Thank you.
22 --- Whereupon the hearing adjourned at 3.27 p.m.
23 to be reconvened on Monday, the 8th day
24 of March, 2010, at 9.00 a.m.
25